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embrace yourself because you're about to

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dive into another free first hour

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episode of the higher side chats and we

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just want to let you know that whether

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you're looking for a companion through

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your paranoid insomnia entertaining

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yourself through one of life's mundane

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activities or trying to ward off the

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internal scream to all those sad

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smothered Souls around the office THC is

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here and you should know that every

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entire second hour four plus members

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sign up at the higher side chats plus

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monthly joint sessions mp3s of THC music

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and bonus episodes for videos and 10%

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miss so become a plus member and treat

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yourself in these troubled times always

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action-packed and commercial for you

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which means you'll unfortunately never

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hear my voice here we go people coming

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in hot from sunny San Diego I'm Greg

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Carl Wood and we are definitely no

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strangers to the world's weirdness

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conspiracies cryptids crop circles spell

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spirits spaceships and the rest of it

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and anyone who digs beyond the surface

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level will find a Pandora's box of

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paranormal sagas and stories itching to

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be told but the strange tale that takes

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the cake as the granddaddy of them all

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has to be the infamous Roswell incident

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where 72 years ago in this very month of

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July the Roswell Army Airfield put out a

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press release that they had found a

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crashed flying saucer and the New Mexico

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desert only to reverse course with their

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weather balloon cover story the

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following day

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and dedicated researchers have been off

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to the races ever since well I figured

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with all the buzz permeating from this

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latest round of UFO enthusiasm it might

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be time to dust off this case and

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re-examine the famous Roswell saga again

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in detail with a Roswell research duo

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that have been plugging away at this

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story for a long time in fact they have

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a combined 57 years of study into just

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this case alone and I'm talking about

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Thomas J Kerry and Donald R Schmidt if

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you're unfamiliar Tom Kerry served in

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the Air Force in his younger days where

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he held a top-secret crypto clearance

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his longtime interest in UFOs led him to

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becoming the MUFON State section

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director for southeastern Pennsylvania

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in 1986 since 1991 he's been solely

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focused on the Roswell case and Tom also

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became a special investigator for the J

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Allen Hynek Center for UFO studies in

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1992 and served on its board of

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directors from 1997 through 2001 through

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that process he partnered up with Donald

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Schmidt who is the former co-director of

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the J Allen Hynek Center for UFO studies

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where he served as director of Special

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Investigations for ten years both of

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these fine gentlemen have written

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extensively about UFOs and the Roswell

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case including several books they've

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written together such as witness to

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Roswell unmasking the government's

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biggest cover-up inside the real area 51

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the secret history of wright-patterson

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the children of Roswell a seven decade

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legacy of fear intimidation and

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cover-ups and the recently released UFO

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secrets inside wright-patterson and with

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that let's get into it keeping the dream

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alive fresh off the plane from the

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annual UFO festival in Roswell New

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Mexico two dedicated Roswell researchers

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extraordinaire Tom and Don welcome to

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the higher side nice to be with you Greg

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yes absolutely

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same here thank you yeah thanks for

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being here guys this is gonna be a lot

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of fun I think this audience is pretty

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well educated on the Roswell incident

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it's obviously one of the foundational

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sagas for a show like this but it is

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July it's 72 years later the

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UFO festival was just this past weekend

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you guys have a new book out that new

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page was kind enough to send to me and

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we definitely have a spike in UFO

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coverage lately and who better to talk

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about it than the dynamic duo with over

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50 years of combined investigation into

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Roswell so here we are but I've wanted

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to take a second ask Tom about this

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top-secret crypto clearance I understand

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this is a clearance for cryptography

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Thea tell us anything more about that

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did your experiences in the Air Force

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ever relate to the UFO issue or did you

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at least get a context for how secrets

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are handled that became useful in the

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Roswell research well actually you know

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when you have the top-secret / whatever

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in my case it was crypto the encryption

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of messages and the decryption of

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messages that's all you were clear top

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secret versus I couldn't go into the

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Pentagon and say hey I have a top secret

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clearance crypto let me see this or that

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it it wouldn't get you very far so to

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answer your question I was in the Air

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Force before I ever heard of Roswell and

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while I did have a sighting on the base

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it had nothing to do with Roswell or

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other UFO incidents so I was pretty much

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busy trying to keep myself afloat in

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what I was doing that was trying to stay

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out of the stockade right yes yeah and

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Don you've written for decades about

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UFOs and Roswell including several books

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with Tom as I mentioned in the intro in

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fact in 2013 your book inside the real

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area51 the secret history of

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wright-patterson was released and now

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six years later you've released UFO

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secrets inside wright-patterson I think

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some listeners might wonder what else we

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need to know about the Roswell case let

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them know what pieces of the puzzle this

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latest book adds that we didn't have

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before how does this one move the needle

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well for having worked personally with

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dr. jail in the inec for those years

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that many felt that he had discounted

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the very notion of crashed saucers

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and really displayed no interest at all

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we have a whole new chapter

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demonstrating that or actually even the

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time he was at Project Blue Book he was

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becoming more and more fascinated with

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the possibility and then as he saw it he

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would often comment I'm an old man in a

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hurry would be working together in the

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field he realized that it was his one

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ace up his sleeve so to speak that he

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could finally trump the air force and

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coming up with physical evidence for the

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reality of the phenomenon so we have a

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lot of new information regarding affine

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ik and even regarding Roswell as he

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himself was evolving into it we have a

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whole new chapter on a lot of lens

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Springfield's personal foul cases that

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specifically focused on wright-patterson

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and some may have been related to

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Roswell and other cases may have

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pertained to other a possible crash

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retrieval cases but Roswell and as you

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call it great gets the granddaddy and

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just to quickly correct you with the Air

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Force specifically I should say the

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Roswell Army Air Corps putting off that

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famous press release on Tuesday July 8th

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but they had actually captured which is

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a bit of a misnomer in itself capturing

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the flying discs the flying saucer but

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it was a mere five hours later that same

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day that going up a chain of command and

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this is where we become infamous the

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balloon press conference in Jungle Roger

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Ramey's office in Fort Worth Texas at

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Carswell Army Airfield where they played

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the old switcheroo and they came out

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with the alternative explanation and

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that's the one that's stuck that's the

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one that for the next 30 years the

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airport's got away with their

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alternative solution the one actually

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crashed back in Roswell in 47

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mmm well that is a great setup and 72

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years I mean a lot has happened since

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then let me ask you about all the UFO

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news lately I find it to be concerning

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and exciting but it's definitely very

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controlled and methodical you write in

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the book about the CIA's infiltration of

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media outlets so when CNN the New York

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Times The Washington Post all start

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talking about these things it's most

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likely because the media handlers want

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them to

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what do you Roswell veterans think about

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what's happening here today

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book break we've had so many of these

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old boy that wouldn't release it now

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episodes I quite frankly am puzzled

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granted they've released this video of

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this and I think it's that video from

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that Navy that really has kept this

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thing going where before it would be one

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person like in 1974 professor Robert

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Spencer car came out down there in

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Florida and started talking about hangar

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18 at wright-patterson of course the big

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stir for a couple day but that was it

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but this one we've had several people of

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you know some standing express interest

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in bringing in the UFO information out

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former Senator Harry Reid from Nevada

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a couple of people that from the Defense

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Department and you have this Lewis

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Elizondo going around he headed up a

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project for five years at the best

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Department trying to determine trends

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and things like that which reminded me a

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project store that they did back in the

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1950s but to answer your question

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whether this is going to lead to

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disclosure which is what I think you're

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hinting out I am more there's a more

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encouraged but I still don't think that

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the Air Force especially is ever going

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to admit this because they have too many

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skeletons in the closet you have to

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admit hey folks we've been lying to you

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for 72 years how about that let's move

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on plus they have so many skeletons

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relating to the highly suppressed the

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Roswell case that I don't see the

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airport's ever changing their position

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or commenting on especially Roswell

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again but the Navy it might be something

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different

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I hold my final thoughts in abeyance I

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can be persuaded either way but I'm sort

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of skeptical well I'm certainly

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skeptical I mean Harry Reid as far as I

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understand I mean he has been one of the

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premier people to block things like

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audit

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of the Federal Reserve and it's like is

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this someone who really likes

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transparency and secrecy a Lozano he has

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strange connections to the CIA and

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counterintelligence from what I

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understand I don't know if these are the

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people that I want in charge a

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disclosure this almost seems like a

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weaponized disclosure well then why

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don't we throw Tom DeLonge into the mix

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as well they're all in I mean my god

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probably got a rock star that I mean who

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holy disavows Roswell he he believes it

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was nothing more than a Nazi bell here's

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a guy who's never been to Roswell has

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never been through Mexico he never spoke

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to a single witness never talked to

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either one of us but now he's the new

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authority on Roswell

274
00:12:24,790 --> 00:12:20,990
well so it kind of speaks of the whole

275
00:12:28,240 --> 00:12:24,800
you know situation and that's why we've

276
00:12:30,610 --> 00:12:28,250
been here before and we can throw mj-12

277
00:12:33,580 --> 00:12:30,620
in the picture and before that with

278
00:12:35,800 --> 00:12:33,590
Hynek with Gerald Ford after that Jimmy

279
00:12:38,200 --> 00:12:35,810
Carter that these carrots have been

280
00:12:41,500 --> 00:12:38,210
dangled for years and then they always

281
00:12:44,680 --> 00:12:41,510
you know come up with some alternative

282
00:12:46,450 --> 00:12:44,690
solution or situation and you biology

283
00:12:49,900 --> 00:12:46,460
are the ones that sit there with the egg

284
00:12:53,230 --> 00:12:49,910
on the face so it's like is it

285
00:12:55,300 --> 00:12:53,240
intentional to discredit us or you'll

286
00:12:57,040 --> 00:12:55,310
continue their spirit endures is to

287
00:12:58,360 --> 00:12:57,050
cover up the fact that they are

288
00:13:00,940 --> 00:12:58,370
experimenting with some new

289
00:13:02,470 --> 00:13:00,950
state-of-the-art technology or are we

290
00:13:05,050 --> 00:13:02,480
dealing with something from the Soviet

291
00:13:06,820 --> 00:13:05,060
Union or China that it's a case of nolle

292
00:13:09,450 --> 00:13:06,830
gotta play catch-up and they're trying

293
00:13:11,710 --> 00:13:09,460
to coax Congress in providing new

294
00:13:18,400 --> 00:13:11,720
additional funding for the defense

295
00:13:20,380 --> 00:13:18,410
budget so again buyer beware indeed and

296
00:13:23,950 --> 00:13:20,390
as you point out repeatedly in the book

297
00:13:26,500 --> 00:13:23,960
it's the Air Force that's really kind of

298
00:13:28,630 --> 00:13:26,510
at the head of the documents that are

299
00:13:31,800 --> 00:13:28,640
involving Roswell and in this latest

300
00:13:34,210 --> 00:13:31,810
push it does seem to be a lot of Navy

301
00:13:36,730 --> 00:13:34,220
reports and it seems like maybe we have

302
00:13:40,810 --> 00:13:36,740
some infighting between military

303
00:13:43,010 --> 00:13:40,820
branches and that is true Craig I want

304
00:13:45,830 --> 00:13:43,020
to hear a pump but

305
00:13:50,240 --> 00:13:45,840
when Project Blue Book was Declassified

306
00:13:52,580 --> 00:13:50,250
in 1977 and much of it wasn't

307
00:13:55,760 --> 00:13:52,590
Declassified for example it mentioned

308
00:13:58,760 --> 00:13:55,770
specifically over 20 gun camera cases

309
00:14:01,310 --> 00:13:58,770
well where are these films where are

310
00:14:03,650 --> 00:14:01,320
these gun camera footage that could

311
00:14:06,680 --> 00:14:03,660
truly serve as physical evidence dealing

312
00:14:09,770 --> 00:14:06,690
with the phenomena and there are just a

313
00:14:12,860 --> 00:14:09,780
smattering just a handful of maybe and

314
00:14:14,660 --> 00:14:12,870
army cases in the blue book piles so if

315
00:14:16,880 --> 00:14:14,670
anybody believes that they weren't

316
00:14:20,450 --> 00:14:16,890
conducting their own investigations

317
00:14:23,570 --> 00:14:20,460
unless we forget Roswell was an army

318
00:14:26,090 --> 00:14:23,580
incident mm-hmm was not Air Force there

319
00:14:28,670 --> 00:14:26,100
was no Air Force back in July of 1947

320
00:14:31,580 --> 00:14:28,680
yes and that becomes kind of the issues

321
00:14:33,560 --> 00:14:31,590
you got to recontextualize exactly when

322
00:14:36,050 --> 00:14:33,570
certain branches were formed and

323
00:14:38,690 --> 00:14:36,060
everything but it is a tangled mess and

324
00:14:41,180 --> 00:14:38,700
a lot of these military branches are in

325
00:14:44,390 --> 00:14:41,190
competition they don't necessarily work

326
00:14:47,420 --> 00:14:44,400
together on a lot of things and a

327
00:14:49,460 --> 00:14:47,430
wonderful recent example of this would

328
00:14:50,210 --> 00:14:49,470
be with Desert Storm and I will never

329
00:14:52,880 --> 00:14:50,220
forget

330
00:14:56,060 --> 00:14:52,890
with Stormin Norman general Norman

331
00:15:00,770 --> 00:14:56,070
Schwarzkopf having his press conference

332
00:15:03,680 --> 00:15:00,780
and he was complaining that he didn't

333
00:15:06,620 --> 00:15:03,690
have open communication with the Navy or

334
00:15:08,810 --> 00:15:06,630
the Air Force that very first raid that

335
00:15:12,020 --> 00:15:08,820
very first night over Baghdad and the

336
00:15:15,320 --> 00:15:12,030
Air Force declared air supremacy over

337
00:15:18,530 --> 00:15:15,330
Iraq well the army didn't know if they

338
00:15:21,140 --> 00:15:18,540
were marched downtown Baghdad or not and

339
00:15:24,020 --> 00:15:21,150
then they weren't hearing from the Navy

340
00:15:27,200 --> 00:15:24,030
who were still lobbying your Tomahawk

341
00:15:29,900 --> 00:15:27,210
missiles into the city so here was a

342
00:15:32,810 --> 00:15:29,910
recent example of where they're not on

343
00:15:34,880 --> 00:15:32,820
the same page mm-hmm and I find you know

344
00:15:36,920 --> 00:15:34,890
that's amazing that after all these

345
00:15:39,620 --> 00:15:36,930
years you're actually correct Craig they

346
00:15:41,570 --> 00:15:39,630
are in competition to one another unless

347
00:15:44,180 --> 00:15:41,580
we forget as far as even at the end of

348
00:15:47,390 --> 00:15:44,190
World War two Curtis LeMay wanted to

349
00:15:50,600 --> 00:15:47,400
continue bombing Germany into submission

350
00:15:52,990 --> 00:15:50,610
and surrender and Eisenhower felt it was

351
00:15:56,840 --> 00:15:53,000
only right that the army would march

352
00:15:59,059 --> 00:15:56,850
downtown Berlin and declare victory

353
00:16:00,949 --> 00:15:59,069
so there's nothing new about this and it

354
00:16:03,529 --> 00:16:00,959
certainly is there's not like nothing

355
00:16:06,529 --> 00:16:03,539
new about their UFO competition either

356
00:16:08,779 --> 00:16:06,539
right exactly that compartmentalization

357
00:16:11,539 --> 00:16:08,789
and competition definitely spills over

358
00:16:12,919 --> 00:16:11,549
into the UFO field and I wanted to quote

359
00:16:15,169 --> 00:16:12,929
the book here because I think you hit on

360
00:16:17,449 --> 00:16:15,179
something super relevant when you say

361
00:16:19,519 --> 00:16:17,459
just a couple of weeks after the weather

362
00:16:22,189 --> 00:16:19,529
balloon explanation was accepted by the

363
00:16:24,439 --> 00:16:22,199
national media the National Security Act

364
00:16:26,539 --> 00:16:24,449
was passed and the CIA the National

365
00:16:28,879 --> 00:16:26,549
Security Council and the Department of

366
00:16:31,129 --> 00:16:28,889
Defense were officially established well

367
00:16:33,469 --> 00:16:31,139
people talk about a private cabal that

368
00:16:35,749 --> 00:16:33,479
acts autonomously within the government

369
00:16:37,819 --> 00:16:35,759
and this seems like the formation of it

370
00:16:40,400 --> 00:16:37,829
right here I guess I would ask how you

371
00:16:42,650 --> 00:16:40,410
guys see that information being relevant

372
00:16:46,219 --> 00:16:42,660
to not only the Roswell situation but

373
00:16:49,779 --> 00:16:46,229
also analyzing disclosure in general and

374
00:16:54,079 --> 00:16:49,789
the mainstream media's role in it well

375
00:16:58,579 --> 00:16:54,089
yes dawn said the event occurred in July

376
00:17:00,469 --> 00:16:58,589
of 1947 and there was no Air Force at

377
00:17:04,809 --> 00:17:00,479
that point it was the Army Air Corps

378
00:17:08,840 --> 00:17:04,819
which was part of the Army Air Forces

379
00:17:11,210 --> 00:17:08,850
which was part of the army so you have

380
00:17:14,299 --> 00:17:11,220
the National Security Act that they

381
00:17:17,629 --> 00:17:14,309
could September something-or-other 1947

382
00:17:22,059 --> 00:17:17,639
you have the new Air Force and the CIA

383
00:17:25,850 --> 00:17:22,069
which was formed out of the OSS and the

384
00:17:28,519 --> 00:17:25,860
Central Intelligence Group C IG as it

385
00:17:32,149 --> 00:17:28,529
was pulled back then so you have all

386
00:17:35,749 --> 00:17:32,159
these new entities formed you know back

387
00:17:38,210 --> 00:17:35,759
then world war two is just over and the

388
00:17:41,499 --> 00:17:38,220
military was held in very high esteem by

389
00:17:43,850 --> 00:17:41,509
all the citizens of the United States

390
00:17:48,129 --> 00:17:43,860
they said it was a weather balloon it

391
00:17:55,580 --> 00:17:53,389
so the media have never I'm talking

392
00:17:56,840 --> 00:17:55,590
about the mainstream media not cable TV

393
00:17:59,740 --> 00:17:56,850
you know where you have shows about

394
00:18:02,810 --> 00:17:59,750
everything but the mainstream media

395
00:18:05,269 --> 00:18:02,820
depends upon their circulation

396
00:18:09,019 --> 00:18:05,279
I believe upon their credibility for

397
00:18:10,790 --> 00:18:09,029
reporting UFOs especially since the

398
00:18:14,810 --> 00:18:10,800
1950s with the contact

399
00:18:17,900 --> 00:18:14,820
the situation UFOs are a taboo subject

400
00:18:23,360 --> 00:18:17,910
and Roswell falls right into that

401
00:18:28,030 --> 00:18:23,370
because in 1993-94 when congressman

402
00:18:32,450 --> 00:18:28,040
Stevens shift instituted a investigation

403
00:18:34,160 --> 00:18:32,460
into the handling of documents relating

404
00:18:35,990 --> 00:18:34,170
to the Roswell incident he was not

405
00:18:38,090 --> 00:18:36,000
trying to solve the Roswell incident

406
00:18:40,730 --> 00:18:38,100
prove it one way or the other he was

407
00:18:42,830 --> 00:18:40,740
trying to see whether the documents had

408
00:18:46,070 --> 00:18:42,840
been handled and classified correctly

409
00:18:48,980 --> 00:18:46,080
well lo and behold the documents had

410
00:18:51,710 --> 00:18:48,990
been destroyed by an unknown authority

411
00:18:54,620 --> 00:18:51,720
having been in the Air Force I know in

412
00:18:58,070 --> 00:18:54,630
the military you need authority to go to

413
00:19:00,230 --> 00:18:58,080
the bathroom and the fact that something

414
00:19:04,340 --> 00:19:00,240
was like this was done under unknown

415
00:19:07,460 --> 00:19:04,350
Authority leads to a speculation like on

416
00:19:12,160 --> 00:19:07,470
something really various is going on

417
00:19:15,080 --> 00:19:12,170
here so the media the general media

418
00:19:19,430 --> 00:19:15,090
because you know in like cable TV it's

419
00:19:22,010 --> 00:19:19,440
you know sharks and UFOs and ghosts are

420
00:19:24,860 --> 00:19:22,020
covered you know they have shows on

421
00:19:29,200 --> 00:19:24,870
those but the mainstream media does not

422
00:19:32,810 --> 00:19:29,210
want to cover UFOs it's a taboo subject

423
00:19:35,810 --> 00:19:32,820
you start covering UFOs if you know if

424
00:19:39,680 --> 00:19:35,820
your congressman or senator oh there

425
00:19:42,370 --> 00:19:39,690
goes senator UFOs you know they're the

426
00:19:44,900 --> 00:19:42,380
old theme song from outer limits and

427
00:19:48,200 --> 00:19:44,910
it's something they don't want to deal

428
00:19:51,130 --> 00:19:48,210
with at all unless it's like the New

429
00:19:54,500 --> 00:19:51,140
York Times they bought the project mogul

430
00:19:56,900 --> 00:19:54,510
hook line and sinker end of story

431
00:19:59,180 --> 00:19:56,910
so I don't know if that answers your

432
00:20:02,930 --> 00:19:59,190
question but by telephone interrupted

433
00:20:03,950 --> 00:20:02,940
like it's no worries no worries I mean

434
00:20:06,650 --> 00:20:03,960
I'm just thinking you know I don't have

435
00:20:08,720 --> 00:20:06,660
the TV network family tree in front of

436
00:20:10,940 --> 00:20:08,730
me but a lot of these even cable

437
00:20:13,300 --> 00:20:10,950
networks and mainstream news

438
00:20:15,800 --> 00:20:13,310
organizations are owned by the same

439
00:20:19,580 --> 00:20:15,810
conglomerate companies up at the top and

440
00:20:23,060 --> 00:20:19,590
it seems like yes taboo and ridicule are

441
00:20:24,409 --> 00:20:23,070
a factor but the biggest factor seems to

442
00:20:27,019 --> 00:20:24,419
be the CIA's info

443
00:20:28,759 --> 00:20:27,029
tration of the media establishment and

444
00:20:30,619 --> 00:20:28,769
them just completely being the

445
00:20:32,090 --> 00:20:30,629
gatekeepers as to what's covered and

446
00:20:34,460 --> 00:20:32,100
when it's covered and how it's covered

447
00:20:37,539 --> 00:20:34,470
wouldn't you say well great you

448
00:20:40,940 --> 00:20:37,549
certainly remember that very famous

449
00:20:45,349 --> 00:20:40,950
expose that Carl Bernstein wrote for

450
00:20:47,330 --> 00:20:45,359
Rolling Stone and he named names and he

451
00:20:50,479 --> 00:20:47,340
went right down the list from the New

452
00:20:53,330 --> 00:20:50,489
York Times to Time magazine Newsweek all

453
00:20:57,259 --> 00:20:53,340
the major newspapers and identified all

454
00:21:00,229 --> 00:20:57,269
the CIA infiltrators and then to learn

455
00:21:03,680 --> 00:21:00,239
afterwards that there are buildings with

456
00:21:06,349 --> 00:21:03,690
thousands of CIA employees that every

457
00:21:09,649 --> 00:21:06,359
day they essentially write and rewrite

458
00:21:11,989 --> 00:21:09,659
the news right and that should be

459
00:21:15,019 --> 00:21:11,999
disconcerting to all of us as Americans

460
00:21:16,820 --> 00:21:15,029
the idea and we often make the comment

461
00:21:21,229 --> 00:21:16,830
you truly want to hear what's going on

462
00:21:23,389 --> 00:21:21,239
in America read the Foreign Press yeah

463
00:21:27,139 --> 00:21:23,399
and as you were talking about the five

464
00:21:30,889 --> 00:21:27,149
major order is now of all the American

465
00:21:35,029 --> 00:21:30,899
media and they're pretty much all on the

466
00:21:37,570 --> 00:21:35,039
same page exactly and that the fact that

467
00:21:40,099 --> 00:21:37,580
we're not getting objective journalism

468
00:21:43,700 --> 00:21:40,109
investigative journalism is a lost art

469
00:21:46,549 --> 00:21:43,710
and the very thought that even reality

470
00:21:48,200 --> 00:21:46,559
shows aren't reality shows I'm sorry

471
00:21:49,999 --> 00:21:48,210
ladies and gentlemen it's all

472
00:21:52,099 --> 00:21:50,009
professional wrestling they are all

473
00:21:54,139 --> 00:21:52,109
scripted cheers to that

474
00:21:56,869 --> 00:21:54,149
they don't like history you know

475
00:22:00,320 --> 00:21:56,879
American history is not taught or not

476
00:22:02,960 --> 00:22:00,330
shown on mainstream media do get some

477
00:22:05,629 --> 00:22:02,970
American history type shows on cable but

478
00:22:08,629 --> 00:22:05,639
the mainstream media like Don says

479
00:22:11,149 --> 00:22:08,639
they're interested in ratings and that's

480
00:22:13,249 --> 00:22:11,159
basically it and certain things are not

481
00:22:16,159 --> 00:22:13,259
covered because they want to keep up

482
00:22:18,919 --> 00:22:16,169
their credibility still I believe major

483
00:22:22,310 --> 00:22:18,929
media is dying I certainly believe that

484
00:22:23,989 --> 00:22:22,320
let's hope absolutely it's almost

485
00:22:25,279 --> 00:22:23,999
counterintuitive that they want their

486
00:22:27,019 --> 00:22:25,289
ratings but then they don't want to

487
00:22:29,930 --> 00:22:27,029
cover the truth and thus they lose their

488
00:22:31,879 --> 00:22:29,940
credibility well what is the truth you

489
00:22:34,549 --> 00:22:31,889
know there are certain subjects though

490
00:22:38,360 --> 00:22:34,559
Greg that just the name of them is

491
00:22:43,010 --> 00:22:38,370
enough to cast aspersions on someone Ted

492
00:22:47,120 --> 00:22:43,020
Abu is is one of those I'm sorry I'm

493
00:22:48,530 --> 00:22:47,130
still recovering well like - I like the

494
00:22:51,950 --> 00:22:48,540
site you may have heard of this great

495
00:22:56,480 --> 00:22:51,960
guy who's good old Japanese murder trial

496
00:23:01,040 --> 00:22:56,490
filmed in 1950 and it was called the

497
00:23:05,260 --> 00:23:01,050
Rashomon effect and it essentially is a

498
00:23:09,130 --> 00:23:05,270
study not only in

499
00:23:12,460 --> 00:23:09,140
Ollis as an IQ test is not really a test

500
00:23:16,270 --> 00:23:12,470
for one's intelligence but rather their

501
00:23:18,670 --> 00:23:16,280
environment mmm the scope of how they

502
00:23:21,310 --> 00:23:18,680
were raised and who were their

503
00:23:25,090 --> 00:23:21,320
influences and their sources for their

504
00:23:29,050 --> 00:23:25,100
information and as the defense presented

505
00:23:31,240 --> 00:23:29,060
one side the prosecution presented

506
00:23:33,460 --> 00:23:31,250
another side and the Rashomon effect is

507
00:23:35,800 --> 00:23:33,470
basically there's your opinion and

508
00:23:38,440 --> 00:23:35,810
there's my opinion and then there's what

509
00:23:41,830 --> 00:23:38,450
really happened and I guess it comes

510
00:23:44,950 --> 00:23:41,840
down to who is really proactively trying

511
00:23:47,770 --> 00:23:44,960
to determine what happened there Tom and

512
00:23:50,080 --> 00:23:47,780
I would certainly challenge any one of

513
00:23:52,750 --> 00:23:50,090
the scoffers any one of the skeptics to

514
00:23:56,159 --> 00:23:52,760
ever demonstrate how they have made any

515
00:23:59,500 --> 00:23:56,169
effort to determine what has happened

516
00:24:02,470 --> 00:23:59,510
specifically regarding Roswell all for

517
00:24:05,409 --> 00:24:02,480
sure it is a tangled web of Thun brings

518
00:24:08,680 --> 00:24:05,419
up a good point there the late Peter

519
00:24:14,039 --> 00:24:08,690
Jennings who had some credibility was

520
00:24:16,870 --> 00:24:14,049
Canadian ABC I think he was on ABC s ABC

521
00:24:18,640 --> 00:24:16,880
he was putting together a show when you

522
00:24:24,430 --> 00:24:18,650
have photos this is just before he died

523
00:24:25,870 --> 00:24:24,440
and he was going to cover Roswell well

524
00:24:27,399 --> 00:24:25,880
you have to cover Roswell if you're

525
00:24:32,320 --> 00:24:27,409
going to put together you know your

526
00:24:35,889 --> 00:24:32,330
boffo TV show and he sent a crew down to

527
00:24:38,710 --> 00:24:35,899
Roswell we went down there to guide the

528
00:24:40,990 --> 00:24:38,720
crew through the production of the

529
00:24:43,630 --> 00:24:41,000
Roswell segment took them out that the

530
00:24:45,909 --> 00:24:43,640
crash site gave them a briefing on what

531
00:24:49,269 --> 00:24:45,919
had happened and Don knows this that

532
00:24:52,450 --> 00:24:49,279
just the look on the crews faces and the

533
00:24:54,610 --> 00:24:52,460
producers faces I'm thinking this guy

534
00:24:56,620 --> 00:24:54,620
that what we're saying is going in one

535
00:24:59,950 --> 00:24:56,630
ear and out the other he's already made

536
00:25:01,240 --> 00:24:59,960
up his mind where the show has and the

537
00:25:03,430 --> 00:25:01,250
proof was in the pudding

538
00:25:06,549 --> 00:25:03,440
Peter Jennings said okay regarding

539
00:25:09,120 --> 00:25:06,559
Roswell it's a myth next subject

540
00:25:12,100 --> 00:25:09,130
and empathy he didn't bring forth any

541
00:25:15,909 --> 00:25:12,110
supporting evidence why he concluded

542
00:25:18,370 --> 00:25:15,919
that Roswell was a myth and he spent

543
00:25:22,180 --> 00:25:18,380
four days in the field working with us

544
00:25:26,200 --> 00:25:22,190
they refused to talk to a single witness

545
00:25:29,289 --> 00:25:26,210
that we offered to provide including dr.

546
00:25:31,180 --> 00:25:29,299
Edgar Mitchell who was there with us and

547
00:25:34,149 --> 00:25:31,190
they wouldn't even talk to him

548
00:25:37,210 --> 00:25:34,159
we had to insist as Tom mention of them

549
00:25:39,279 --> 00:25:37,220
going out the crash site and then they

550
00:25:43,860 --> 00:25:39,289
didn't use a single minute of the

551
00:25:47,409 --> 00:25:43,870
footage the b-roll that we provided they

552
00:25:49,870 --> 00:25:47,419
concocted other networks that they asked

553
00:25:52,299 --> 00:25:49,880
us to provide for the actual premiere

554
00:25:54,789 --> 00:25:52,309
the shortest time said the fact that was

555
00:25:58,230 --> 00:25:54,799
in the opening minute he used the word

556
00:26:01,060 --> 00:25:58,240
myth five times that was their agenda

557
00:26:02,860 --> 00:26:01,070
yes I know that has definitely been

558
00:26:04,990 --> 00:26:02,870
something that has riddled the ufology

559
00:26:07,770 --> 00:26:05,000
community for decades but I'd say this

560
00:26:08,920 --> 00:26:07,780
audience is well past the denial

561
00:26:12,250 --> 00:26:08,930
position

562
00:26:14,080 --> 00:26:12,260
and to jump into the book you know one

563
00:26:16,450 --> 00:26:14,090
of the biggest criticisms of a

564
00:26:18,400 --> 00:26:16,460
conspiratorial story like Roswell as

565
00:26:20,770 --> 00:26:18,410
always well you couldn't keep a secret

566
00:26:23,140 --> 00:26:20,780
this big someone would talk and if you

567
00:26:25,630 --> 00:26:23,150
actually dig into it you find people do

568
00:26:27,820 --> 00:26:25,640
talk maybe not carelessly in a public

569
00:26:30,640 --> 00:26:27,830
forum but you have many many anecdotes

570
00:26:32,320 --> 00:26:30,650
along the lines of oh well my dad told

571
00:26:33,910 --> 00:26:32,330
me about this before he died or he

572
00:26:36,400 --> 00:26:33,920
showed me a picture and said never to

573
00:26:37,450 --> 00:26:36,410
talk about it even Jesse Marcel jr.

574
00:26:39,400 --> 00:26:37,460
whose dad was in the Air Force

575
00:26:41,680 --> 00:26:39,410
intelligence officer in charge of moving

576
00:26:44,080 --> 00:26:41,690
some of the material he even stopped by

577
00:26:47,110 --> 00:26:44,090
his house to show his son apparently and

578
00:26:49,660 --> 00:26:47,120
it's just these kind of stories are all

579
00:26:51,700 --> 00:26:49,670
over the place so people do talk exactly

580
00:26:54,700 --> 00:26:51,710
Greg let me just quickly jump in here

581
00:26:57,640 --> 00:26:54,710
because you make the point that we here

582
00:27:00,070 --> 00:26:57,650
to this day that they couldn't keep this

583
00:27:02,740 --> 00:27:00,080
a secret that it would have leaked out

584
00:27:06,370 --> 00:27:02,750
many years ago well it has been leaking

585
00:27:08,590 --> 00:27:06,380
out for the past 40 years and I'm sorry

586
00:27:10,870 --> 00:27:08,600
people have not been listening people

587
00:27:12,040 --> 00:27:10,880
and again the press have been turning a

588
00:27:14,410 --> 00:27:12,050
deaf ear

589
00:27:17,080 --> 00:27:14,420
now you mentioned just my cell and how

590
00:27:20,110 --> 00:27:17,090
about his dad just Marcel senior when he

591
00:27:22,570 --> 00:27:20,120
went public in 1978 he was dying of

592
00:27:24,310 --> 00:27:22,580
emphysema you didn't read about this in

593
00:27:26,890 --> 00:27:24,320
The Times you can read about this

594
00:27:29,350 --> 00:27:26,900
anywhere because the only publication

595
00:27:32,140 --> 00:27:29,360
that even touched it was the National

596
00:27:35,470 --> 00:27:32,150
Enquirer so what does that say about as

597
00:27:38,230 --> 00:27:35,480
far as our media even back then you had

598
00:27:40,840 --> 00:27:38,240
the senior intelligence officer of the

599
00:27:43,360 --> 00:27:40,850
first atomic bomb squadron coming

600
00:27:45,580 --> 00:27:43,370
forward on his deathbed and saying that

601
00:27:47,220 --> 00:27:45,590
I handle pieces of an actual flying

602
00:27:50,580 --> 00:27:47,230
saucer

603
00:27:53,279 --> 00:27:50,590
and he was silenced and the same has

604
00:27:56,100 --> 00:27:53,289
been for general Thomas de Paul is in

605
00:27:59,820 --> 00:27:56,110
general Arthur X on and on and on and on

606
00:28:01,950 --> 00:27:59,830
so that is an absolute fabrication the

607
00:28:04,649 --> 00:28:01,960
idea and not you great but I mean the

608
00:28:07,409 --> 00:28:04,659
idea that well it would have leaked out

609
00:28:09,779 --> 00:28:07,419
you know all this time well it has been

610
00:28:12,600 --> 00:28:09,789
right and the problem is they're not

611
00:28:16,409 --> 00:28:12,610
listening they don't want to listen they

612
00:28:18,480 --> 00:28:16,419
refuse to listen so true yes I'm trying

613
00:28:22,169 --> 00:28:18,490
to think back like Don says you know

614
00:28:24,149 --> 00:28:22,179
people talked among themselves and Edgar

615
00:28:27,090 --> 00:28:24,159
Mitchell told us that he first heard

616
00:28:29,519 --> 00:28:27,100
about the basic truths about Roswell

617
00:28:31,799 --> 00:28:29,529
after he walked on the moon he came back

618
00:28:34,409 --> 00:28:31,809
and aggravate chills from the Roswell

619
00:28:35,850 --> 00:28:34,419
area he grew up in Artesia but I think

620
00:28:37,919 --> 00:28:35,860
he was I don't know if he's born in

621
00:28:39,930 --> 00:28:37,929
Roswell but Artesia is pretty closed

622
00:28:43,820 --> 00:28:39,940
he had the ranch guess out of Roswell

623
00:28:46,889 --> 00:28:43,830
yeah yes and all of a sudden all these

624
00:28:49,980 --> 00:28:46,899
ranchers they trusted him because you

625
00:28:52,200 --> 00:28:49,990
know he was a MIT scientist he walked on

626
00:28:54,899 --> 00:28:52,210
the moon the astronaut they felt that

627
00:28:57,629 --> 00:28:54,909
they could tell him what they knew about

628
00:29:00,180 --> 00:28:57,639
Roswell and that's when he started you

629
00:29:02,879 --> 00:29:00,190
know being interested in the case and

630
00:29:05,460 --> 00:29:02,889
that went on for years and I'm trying to

631
00:29:08,310 --> 00:29:05,470
think back I believe the first statement

632
00:29:10,259 --> 00:29:08,320
by a participant occurred in one of

633
00:29:13,169 --> 00:29:10,269
those men's magazines back in the early

634
00:29:15,120 --> 00:29:13,179
70s I don't know was Argosy or true or

635
00:29:18,029 --> 00:29:15,130
one of those magazines they don't make

636
00:29:21,419 --> 00:29:18,039
them anymore by a woman named Lydia

637
00:29:24,870 --> 00:29:21,429
sleppy she was involved in the case she

638
00:29:28,799 --> 00:29:24,880
was trying to dictate a wire release for

639
00:29:32,389 --> 00:29:28,809
one of the news services and the FBI cut

640
00:29:36,690 --> 00:29:32,399
her off cease and desist but that story

641
00:29:39,570 --> 00:29:36,700
appeared I believe around 1972 or 74 so

642
00:29:43,289 --> 00:29:39,580
like Don says the case has been leaking

643
00:29:45,509 --> 00:29:43,299
ever since and we have a colleague of

644
00:29:48,480 --> 00:29:45,519
ours we don't see him very often but

645
00:29:49,889 --> 00:29:48,490
he's one of the abduction guys you know

646
00:29:52,289 --> 00:29:49,899
he's written a couple books about

647
00:29:53,940 --> 00:29:52,299
abductions but he says you know I don't

648
00:29:56,700 --> 00:29:53,950
believe in Roswell or I don't think it

649
00:29:59,519 --> 00:29:56,710
why because they couldn't keep that

650
00:30:00,930 --> 00:29:59,529
secret well guess what they haven't kept

651
00:30:02,850 --> 00:30:00,940
it secret but

652
00:30:04,740 --> 00:30:02,860
they use that thinking well you don't

653
00:30:07,140 --> 00:30:04,750
know anything and you're not going to

654
00:30:10,470 --> 00:30:07,150
look challenge me and so let me just

655
00:30:13,680 --> 00:30:10,480
imagine as tom was describing dr. Edgar

656
00:30:16,200 --> 00:30:13,690
Mitchell and his credentials I mean

657
00:30:18,000 --> 00:30:16,210
there are a few in this world that have

658
00:30:20,790 --> 00:30:18,010
higher credentials and look what the

659
00:30:23,910 --> 00:30:20,800
American media did to him

660
00:30:26,970 --> 00:30:23,920
I mean he was immediately labeled as far

661
00:30:29,310 --> 00:30:26,980
as senile and demented and that he

662
00:30:32,040 --> 00:30:29,320
needed to be placed in a retirement

663
00:30:34,500 --> 00:30:32,050
facility and he got a fair shake in the

664
00:30:37,500 --> 00:30:34,510
Foreign Press but I mean it was

665
00:30:39,600 --> 00:30:37,510
scandalous what they did to him you know

666
00:30:42,720 --> 00:30:39,610
you're talking about an American girl

667
00:30:46,500 --> 00:30:42,730
you know American treasure and for

668
00:30:49,020 --> 00:30:46,510
nothing more than defending Roswell and

669
00:30:51,150 --> 00:30:49,030
the people that he grew up with the

670
00:30:53,190 --> 00:30:51,160
people he knew personally his neighbors

671
00:30:54,810 --> 00:30:53,200
his friends and then the high ranking

672
00:30:57,840 --> 00:30:54,820
officers as Tom mentioned at the

673
00:31:01,440 --> 00:30:57,850
Pentagon that told him that this all was

674
00:31:04,290 --> 00:31:01,450
genuine it was authentic it was true and

675
00:31:05,580 --> 00:31:04,300
again it was taboo it was off-limits how

676
00:31:08,490 --> 00:31:05,590
dare you

677
00:31:11,520 --> 00:31:08,500
dr. Mitchell step out of bounds and

678
00:31:14,640 --> 00:31:11,530
actually leak out information about this

679
00:31:17,400 --> 00:31:14,650
so again it's total fabrication total

680
00:31:20,340 --> 00:31:17,410
nonsense that people haven't been trying

681
00:31:22,350 --> 00:31:20,350
to present the truth about this it's

682
00:31:25,080 --> 00:31:22,360
just that the skeptics are always

683
00:31:27,780 --> 00:31:25,090
immediately right there to smear these

684
00:31:31,110 --> 00:31:27,790
people and make the next person think

685
00:31:32,430 --> 00:31:31,120
twice about coming forward well said and

686
00:31:36,090 --> 00:31:32,440
I mean I'm sitting right here with your

687
00:31:38,160 --> 00:31:36,100
latest book 275 pages of anecdotes and

688
00:31:40,530 --> 00:31:38,170
plenty of stories of people talking and

689
00:31:43,530 --> 00:31:40,540
this one mainly focuses on the fact that

690
00:31:46,470 --> 00:31:43,540
this material and these alien bodies

691
00:31:49,950 --> 00:31:46,480
made it to wright-patterson which is in

692
00:31:51,990 --> 00:31:49,960
Ohio and this is a line in the book that

693
00:31:54,240 --> 00:31:52,000
I found curious where you say as a

694
00:31:56,820 --> 00:31:54,250
fitting tribute to Wright Patterson's

695
00:31:59,100 --> 00:31:56,830
dedication to our national security the

696
00:32:01,410 --> 00:31:59,110
personal files of Nikola Tesla are

697
00:32:03,270 --> 00:32:01,420
preserved there that's interesting but I

698
00:32:05,130 --> 00:32:03,280
don't see the connection between housing

699
00:32:07,890 --> 00:32:05,140
Tesla's files and our national security

700
00:32:10,230 --> 00:32:07,900
because the rumors suggest that Tesla's

701
00:32:12,270 --> 00:32:10,240
work showcased energy systems and

702
00:32:14,520 --> 00:32:12,280
delivery methods that would have upset

703
00:32:17,310 --> 00:32:14,530
General Electric Westinghouse and the

704
00:32:18,720 --> 00:32:17,320
cartel of oil men and oil control seems

705
00:32:21,090 --> 00:32:18,730
to have been the driving force for geo

706
00:32:22,950 --> 00:32:21,100
political games that hold us back more

707
00:32:25,470 --> 00:32:22,960
than anything I guess I would just ask

708
00:32:27,630 --> 00:32:25,480
you to elaborate on that line and what

709
00:32:29,010 --> 00:32:27,640
your thoughts are on Tesla's papers and

710
00:32:30,990 --> 00:32:29,020
why keeping them locked up at

711
00:32:33,960 --> 00:32:31,000
wright-patterson speaks to its

712
00:32:40,129 --> 00:32:33,970
dedication to our national security

713
00:32:43,529 --> 00:32:40,139
I think that was Dawn's oh I'm sorry

714
00:32:45,450 --> 00:32:43,539
Donny there I think it was you urged it

715
00:32:47,850 --> 00:32:45,460
was a point that was made by former

716
00:32:51,060 --> 00:32:47,860
deputy commander at the base at the time

717
00:32:53,490 --> 00:32:51,070
that Lester halt with NBC News we were

718
00:32:55,090 --> 00:32:53,500
trying to bring a film crew onto the

719
00:32:58,019 --> 00:32:55,100
base

720
00:33:02,110 --> 00:32:58,029
and it was somebody at the Museum who

721
00:33:05,200 --> 00:33:02,120
made that point that to suggest that

722
00:33:08,620 --> 00:33:05,210
right pad had sub levels underground

723
00:33:10,980 --> 00:33:08,630
levels and they brought up the Tesla

724
00:33:12,870 --> 00:33:10,990
papers

725
00:33:15,110 --> 00:33:12,880
everything was above board that if you

726
00:33:18,200 --> 00:33:15,120
wanted to find anything at right paths

727
00:33:22,020 --> 00:33:18,210
it wasn't a problem for even tool a

728
00:33:23,820 --> 00:33:22,030
researcher hmm can't be just mentioned

729
00:33:27,210 --> 00:33:23,830
that in conjunction with the fact that

730
00:33:30,720 --> 00:33:27,220
right pat has a long history of keeping

731
00:33:32,940 --> 00:33:30,730
secrets and secret testing you mention

732
00:33:36,330 --> 00:33:32,950
and test them well we could throw thomas

733
00:33:39,360 --> 00:33:36,340
edison into the mix as well who was his

734
00:33:42,810 --> 00:33:39,370
main competition and in many ways his

735
00:33:45,680 --> 00:33:42,820
students he betrayed him and used a lot

736
00:33:48,180 --> 00:33:45,690
of Tesla's own technology for his own

737
00:33:50,100 --> 00:33:48,190
yes and it also has to feel very

738
00:33:52,440 --> 00:33:50,110
significant that our current presidents

739
00:33:54,540 --> 00:33:52,450
uncles the very MIT scientist who has

740
00:33:56,520 --> 00:33:54,550
given full access to assessing Tesla's

741
00:33:59,040 --> 00:33:56,530
papers and uncle he talks a lot about

742
00:34:00,720 --> 00:33:59,050
now he's launching a space force and his

743
00:34:03,240 --> 00:34:00,730
political opponents seem to be the ones

744
00:34:04,610 --> 00:34:03,250
driving the current UFO narrative and I

745
00:34:07,470 --> 00:34:04,620
don't know but I would definitely

746
00:34:11,550 --> 00:34:07,480
suspect that Tesla's work is at least

747
00:34:13,770 --> 00:34:11,560
relevant to the UFO question and I guess

748
00:34:16,020 --> 00:34:13,780
I would ask how you guys assess that I

749
00:34:17,760 --> 00:34:16,030
mean it's very curious that in this big

750
00:34:19,849 --> 00:34:17,770
world that this particular guy is

751
00:34:22,080 --> 00:34:19,859
president he has such a connection to

752
00:34:26,250 --> 00:34:22,090
technological secrets that are wrapped

753
00:34:28,800 --> 00:34:26,260
up in the UFO data and as we know Tesla

754
00:34:32,340 --> 00:34:28,810
was occasionally even asked about UFOs

755
00:34:34,770 --> 00:34:32,350
and publicly he would always downplay

756
00:34:39,629 --> 00:34:34,780
the situation and I think it was mainly

757
00:34:43,460 --> 00:34:39,639
because he had you know his biggest

758
00:34:45,080 --> 00:34:43,470
obstacle was securing government funding

759
00:34:46,700 --> 00:34:45,090
and it was no different than Robert

760
00:34:48,740 --> 00:34:46,710
Goddard the true father of modern

761
00:34:52,760 --> 00:34:48,750
rocketry who happens to be from Roswell

762
00:34:55,490 --> 00:34:52,770
and again yet they don't secure the

763
00:34:57,680 --> 00:34:55,500
funding and we have to remember of which

764
00:35:00,560 --> 00:34:57,690
the best example of all would be the

765
00:35:03,620 --> 00:35:00,570
late Carl Sagan the fact that you go

766
00:35:06,230 --> 00:35:03,630
back to Sagan's first writings on ufos

767
00:35:08,510 --> 00:35:06,240
back in the late 60s he was actually

768
00:35:11,140 --> 00:35:08,520
quite positive he was a bit of an

769
00:35:13,760 --> 00:35:11,150
advocate he was very open to the idea

770
00:35:15,740 --> 00:35:13,770
that we were being visited but how

771
00:35:17,930 --> 00:35:15,750
quickly they sell their souls to the

772
00:35:20,480 --> 00:35:17,940
devil so to speak and they get their

773
00:35:23,540 --> 00:35:20,490
grants they get their government funding

774
00:35:28,670 --> 00:35:23,550
on their pet projects and just like that

775
00:35:32,320 --> 00:35:28,680
well you have to essentially cooperate

776
00:35:35,150 --> 00:35:32,330
with the puppeteer and as a result they

777
00:35:37,220 --> 00:35:35,160
totally you know become part of the

778
00:35:39,080 --> 00:35:37,230
skeptical community and that's one of

779
00:35:43,070 --> 00:35:39,090
the reasons that dr. J Allen Hynek

780
00:35:45,500 --> 00:35:43,080
was so genuine for the fact that he was

781
00:35:47,810 --> 00:35:45,510
initially a skeptic he was their chief

782
00:35:50,690 --> 00:35:47,820
debunker they would trot him out

783
00:35:53,450 --> 00:35:50,700
only when they needed him to explain

784
00:35:56,300 --> 00:35:53,460
away a plickers sighting but he was

785
00:35:59,600 --> 00:35:56,310
genuine he was enough of a scientist and

786
00:36:01,850 --> 00:35:59,610
he realized that something was a missed

787
00:36:04,730 --> 00:36:01,860
something was going on here that all

788
00:36:07,250 --> 00:36:04,740
these witnesses just could not be lying

789
00:36:10,160 --> 00:36:07,260
and as far as whether it's the SETI

790
00:36:13,370 --> 00:36:10,170
program or even mentioning Sagan the

791
00:36:17,120 --> 00:36:13,380
fact that once the government carrot is

792
00:36:21,260 --> 00:36:17,130
dangled in front of them how often they

793
00:36:23,720 --> 00:36:21,270
sell their souls hmm totally agree i'ma

794
00:36:32,000 --> 00:36:23,730
do that but they haven't taken me up on

795
00:36:34,280 --> 00:36:32,010
that so yeah time right now yes we would

796
00:36:37,160 --> 00:36:34,290
when we went on and I talked on the

797
00:36:41,900 --> 00:36:37,170
phone once in a while we hear a click or

798
00:36:44,570 --> 00:36:41,910
two and I always mentioned it done that

799
00:36:47,900 --> 00:36:44,580
in case they're listening I'm available

800
00:36:52,640 --> 00:36:47,910
yeah I'm out of here for a couple pow

801
00:36:53,150 --> 00:36:52,650
yeah yes well that's funny if it's again

802
00:36:55,339 --> 00:36:53,160
to the

803
00:36:57,470 --> 00:36:55,349
of Roswell you write that when it comes

804
00:36:59,690 --> 00:36:57,480
to the things recovered from the site on

805
00:37:01,400 --> 00:36:59,700
top of the four dead bodies and the one

806
00:37:03,559 --> 00:37:01,410
that survived the crash we have four

807
00:37:06,160 --> 00:37:03,569
categories of wreckage can you tell the

808
00:37:08,990 --> 00:37:06,170
people about these wreckage categories

809
00:37:11,630 --> 00:37:09,000
yes there were three crash sites

810
00:37:14,450 --> 00:37:11,640
involved in Roswell rivers with the so

811
00:37:18,079 --> 00:37:14,460
called debris field site which was a

812
00:37:20,720 --> 00:37:18,089
site below the location where they ship

813
00:37:23,930 --> 00:37:20,730
exploded the ship didn't crash it

814
00:37:26,630 --> 00:37:23,940
exploded in the air we believe it was

815
00:37:28,609 --> 00:37:26,640
from a lightning strike Greg it was

816
00:37:31,069 --> 00:37:28,619
either an internal explosion or a

817
00:37:33,740 --> 00:37:31,079
lightning strike because we have several

818
00:37:35,960 --> 00:37:33,750
witnesses who said well I heard a

819
00:37:37,789 --> 00:37:35,970
muffled explosion during a thunder and

820
00:37:40,670 --> 00:37:37,799
lightning storm which they have during

821
00:37:44,029 --> 00:37:40,680
that time of the year down in New Mexico

822
00:37:49,220 --> 00:37:44,039
so the first site is the debris field

823
00:37:53,000 --> 00:37:49,230
site where all this strange small pieces

824
00:37:54,799 --> 00:37:53,010
of metal were found there was something

825
00:37:56,690 --> 00:37:54,809
called memory mat we call it memory

826
00:37:57,710 --> 00:37:56,700
metal it's our Holy Grail that's what

827
00:38:01,039 --> 00:37:57,720
we're looking for

828
00:38:03,799 --> 00:38:01,049
it's metal that you can't scratch you

829
00:38:05,839 --> 00:38:03,809
can't cut you can't deform it

830
00:38:09,589 --> 00:38:05,849
permanently in any way it's laid as a

831
00:38:12,470 --> 00:38:09,599
feather very thin but you can wad it up

832
00:38:13,880 --> 00:38:12,480
into a ball in your hand it feels like

833
00:38:17,440 --> 00:38:13,890
you don't have anything in your hand

834
00:38:20,630 --> 00:38:17,450
open your hand and then unfurls itself

835
00:38:23,029 --> 00:38:20,640
okay and like I said it's indestructible

836
00:38:25,069 --> 00:38:23,039
have we've been trying to back engineer

837
00:38:29,750 --> 00:38:25,079
it ever since then there are the pieces

838
00:38:31,819 --> 00:38:29,760
that are thin like thin aluminum but you

839
00:38:35,000 --> 00:38:31,829
can't bend them you can't take a

840
00:38:37,099 --> 00:38:35,010
sledgehammer to them and crack them or

841
00:38:39,019 --> 00:38:37,109
do anything to them the sledgehammer

842
00:38:42,710 --> 00:38:39,029
will come back and hit you in the nose

843
00:38:46,099 --> 00:38:42,720
you know so that's a second type very

844
00:38:49,069 --> 00:38:46,109
stiff indestructible can't scratch it

845
00:38:51,980 --> 00:38:49,079
then you have the memory metal the third

846
00:38:55,339 --> 00:38:51,990
type was something that Jesse Marcel and

847
00:38:58,010 --> 00:38:55,349
Marcel senior talked about this I beam

848
00:39:00,380 --> 00:38:58,020
it's shaped like it's like a rod but

849
00:39:04,340 --> 00:39:00,390
it's gonna cross section it's safe like

850
00:39:07,610 --> 00:39:04,350
an eye and on that eye beam

851
00:39:11,030 --> 00:39:07,620
were symbols strange symbols strange

852
00:39:14,270 --> 00:39:11,040
markings that we had linguist come and

853
00:39:17,030 --> 00:39:14,280
they couldn't decipher it so we believed

854
00:39:19,430 --> 00:39:17,040
at least I do anyway that that i-beam

855
00:39:22,340 --> 00:39:19,440
had something to do with the propulsion

856
00:39:24,670 --> 00:39:22,350
of the ship sort of like in the movie

857
00:39:27,020 --> 00:39:24,680
The Da Vinci Code you know where they

858
00:39:30,140 --> 00:39:27,030
want to open the door they have this

859
00:39:32,240 --> 00:39:30,150
little thing they insert into a key and

860
00:39:34,160 --> 00:39:32,250
that opens the whatever they were

861
00:39:35,450 --> 00:39:34,170
looking for so I think the i-beam was

862
00:39:38,450 --> 00:39:35,460
something to do with the either

863
00:39:41,600 --> 00:39:38,460
directional or guiding the ship in some

864
00:39:43,760 --> 00:39:41,610
way so about the third type the fourth

865
00:39:46,400 --> 00:39:43,770
type well I guess actually there was a

866
00:39:49,460 --> 00:39:46,410
tomb or one was the monofilament like

867
00:39:52,160 --> 00:39:49,470
fiber optics it sort of adumbrated the

868
00:39:53,870 --> 00:39:52,170
fiber optics that we have today there

869
00:39:56,990 --> 00:39:53,880
was a lot of that and there was

870
00:40:00,260 --> 00:39:57,000
something that Jesse jr. talked about

871
00:40:03,740 --> 00:40:00,270
this resembled bakelite I have no idea

872
00:40:07,250 --> 00:40:03,750
without the purpose or what it you know

873
00:40:09,620 --> 00:40:07,260
it but it resembled bakelite and I guess

874
00:40:14,060 --> 00:40:09,630
there was another you know the inner

875
00:40:17,120 --> 00:40:14,070
cabin or a egg-shaped escape pod of some

876
00:40:21,290 --> 00:40:17,130
sort continued on after the ship

877
00:40:24,920 --> 00:40:21,300
exploded and two beings were thrown out

878
00:40:27,340 --> 00:40:24,930
and met their fate on a low bluff about

879
00:40:30,410 --> 00:40:27,350
two miles east of the debris field site

880
00:40:32,780 --> 00:40:30,420
we call it the deep rocker body site

881
00:40:35,630 --> 00:40:32,790
because it was deep Proctor who showed

882
00:40:38,120 --> 00:40:35,640
his mother where it was and she showed

883
00:40:40,910 --> 00:40:38,130
us so it's where two bodies had come

884
00:40:45,130 --> 00:40:40,920
down and you know met they're here after

885
00:40:48,830 --> 00:40:45,140
but after the explosion the inner cabin

886
00:40:51,560 --> 00:40:48,840
survived and Peary you on another

887
00:40:55,460 --> 00:40:51,570
trajectory for about 30 miles 35 miles

888
00:40:58,250 --> 00:40:55,470
east southeast towards Roswell came to

889
00:41:01,610 --> 00:40:58,260
rest about 32 miles north-northwest of

890
00:41:05,990 --> 00:41:01,620
Roswell and there they found two more

891
00:41:09,560 --> 00:41:06,000
bodies that were dead and one that was

892
00:41:11,930 --> 00:41:09,570
alive I'm still walking around so I

893
00:41:14,480 --> 00:41:11,940
think that was a little more than four

894
00:41:16,200 --> 00:41:14,490
but that's basically what all the record

895
00:41:18,750 --> 00:41:16,210
consisted of

896
00:41:21,180 --> 00:41:18,760
yes that is a great summary and it's

897
00:41:23,730 --> 00:41:21,190
definitely fascinating to try to follow

898
00:41:26,130 --> 00:41:23,740
the chain of custody of this material

899
00:41:28,290 --> 00:41:26,140
and the bodies and of course your book

900
00:41:30,960 --> 00:41:28,300
is about all the sagas that take this

901
00:41:34,940 --> 00:41:30,970
stuff to wright-patterson I would ask in

902
00:41:38,760 --> 00:41:34,950
more recent years wouldn't the spotlight

903
00:41:41,790 --> 00:41:38,770
be better put on Lockheed Martin or

904
00:41:44,670 --> 00:41:41,800
Boeing or Bigelow airspace and the rest

905
00:41:47,370 --> 00:41:44,680
of the corporate Eternals isn't that

906
00:41:49,620 --> 00:41:47,380
most likely where this stuff is now with

907
00:41:51,390 --> 00:41:49,630
guys like Jacques valet and the

908
00:41:54,900 --> 00:41:51,400
invisible college in the Silicon Valley

909
00:41:57,780 --> 00:41:54,910
tech billionaires oh yes of course

910
00:42:00,870 --> 00:41:57,790
in fact this to remind your audience the

911
00:42:02,790 --> 00:42:00,880
government slash military doesn't

912
00:42:05,910 --> 00:42:02,800
manufacture anything everything is

913
00:42:08,370 --> 00:42:05,920
contracted out to the private sector and

914
00:42:11,180 --> 00:42:08,380
as a result through the years we've had

915
00:42:15,210 --> 00:42:11,190
firsthand witnesses at patel institute

916
00:42:18,089 --> 00:42:15,220
grand corporation views aircraft general

917
00:42:21,120 --> 00:42:18,099
electric boeing bureau standards are

918
00:42:23,520 --> 00:42:21,130
talking about having an opportunity to

919
00:42:25,650 --> 00:42:23,530
test and possibly come up with a

920
00:42:29,280 --> 00:42:25,660
breakthrough regarding some of the

921
00:42:32,309 --> 00:42:29,290
roswell material we had a retired base

922
00:42:35,160 --> 00:42:32,319
commander told us that much of the

923
00:42:37,710 --> 00:42:35,170
physical evidence that was housed and

924
00:42:40,620 --> 00:42:37,720
tested at wright-patt was all cleared

925
00:42:42,960 --> 00:42:40,630
out in the early 80s and as he put it

926
00:42:45,660 --> 00:42:42,970
they had a hell of a time bringing

927
00:42:47,910 --> 00:42:45,670
things in and moving things out given

928
00:42:51,059 --> 00:42:47,920
that they were essentially in downtown

929
00:42:53,819 --> 00:42:51,069
dayton when you consider through the

930
00:42:57,059 --> 00:42:53,829
remote areas of the southwest and the

931
00:42:58,770 --> 00:42:57,069
mountainous ranges that many of our

932
00:43:02,309 --> 00:42:58,780
military facilities have been

933
00:43:04,710 --> 00:43:02,319
established they were really just been

934
00:43:06,510 --> 00:43:04,720
connected with the East Coast and the

935
00:43:10,200 --> 00:43:06,520
Pentagon that they even happened to

936
00:43:12,500 --> 00:43:10,210
establish a base in Dayton Ohio back

937
00:43:16,440 --> 00:43:12,510
during World War one for that matter

938
00:43:21,480 --> 00:43:16,450
Greg I'd like to add that we believe at

939
00:43:24,210 --> 00:43:21,490
least I do that the UFO let's call them

940
00:43:27,390 --> 00:43:24,220
artifacts you know physical and

941
00:43:29,940 --> 00:43:27,400
biological not only Roswell but the UFO

942
00:43:32,069 --> 00:43:29,950
artifacts are now in

943
00:43:35,310 --> 00:43:32,079
- hands and by private hands I mean

944
00:43:38,069 --> 00:43:35,320
Lockheed Martin Mattel Memorial and all

945
00:43:39,720 --> 00:43:38,079
the other government contractors rather

946
00:43:44,040 --> 00:43:39,730
than being in the possession of the

947
00:43:47,010 --> 00:43:44,050
military so we believe that I think Donn

948
00:43:49,200 --> 00:43:47,020
does but I do yes yes yes well hardly

949
00:43:52,290 --> 00:43:49,210
and one of the reasons being that

950
00:43:54,510 --> 00:43:52,300
private organizations are not subject to

951
00:43:56,700 --> 00:43:54,520
FOIA requests where the government

952
00:43:58,260 --> 00:43:56,710
entities are so that's one of the

953
00:44:00,480 --> 00:43:58,270
reasons I don't think that's the entire

954
00:44:03,180 --> 00:44:00,490
region but they're not subject to FOIA

955
00:44:06,030 --> 00:44:03,190
enquiries Tom why don't you even cite

956
00:44:10,319 --> 00:44:06,040
the example or the comments by other

957
00:44:12,690 --> 00:44:10,329
likes like a been rich for example yes I

958
00:44:15,000 --> 00:44:12,700
don't know what the occasion was but

959
00:44:18,359 --> 00:44:15,010
then rich was being queried about a

960
00:44:22,349 --> 00:44:18,369
number of things and one of them what

961
00:44:24,120 --> 00:44:22,359
about UFOs mr. rich he says well they're

962
00:44:27,630 --> 00:44:24,130
the ones that we make and the ones that

963
00:44:29,540 --> 00:44:27,640
they make and they meaning someone off

964
00:44:31,730 --> 00:44:29,550
planet

965
00:44:34,130 --> 00:44:31,740
and he also added a comment on another

966
00:44:39,200 --> 00:44:34,140
occasion that we currently had the

967
00:44:40,930 --> 00:44:39,210
technology to take e.t poll so we've

968
00:44:43,520 --> 00:44:40,940
long have heard and we've always

969
00:44:47,690 --> 00:44:43,530
suspected that specifically in the

970
00:44:51,110 --> 00:44:47,700
military the old order did not pass it

971
00:44:52,760 --> 00:44:51,120
down to the new most of them took it

972
00:44:54,830 --> 00:44:52,770
with them and I'm talking about the

973
00:44:56,720 --> 00:44:54,840
knowledge of what they knew to be the

974
00:44:59,330 --> 00:44:56,730
truth there's been specifically

975
00:45:02,780 --> 00:44:59,340
regarding Roswell and UFOs in general

976
00:45:06,500 --> 00:45:02,790
and there's this young growing faction

977
00:45:09,470 --> 00:45:06,510
within the military that wants this to

978
00:45:11,750 --> 00:45:09,480
come out they desire for this to finally

979
00:45:13,730 --> 00:45:11,760
come out and acknowledge what they've

980
00:45:15,650 --> 00:45:13,740
been observing and experiencing for all

981
00:45:17,870 --> 00:45:15,660
these decades but they don't have access

982
00:45:19,670 --> 00:45:17,880
the alarm clearance and that's where Tom

983
00:45:22,460 --> 00:45:19,680
and I and he's correct we believe that

984
00:45:25,940 --> 00:45:22,470
because and it's where Eisenhower has

985
00:45:29,510 --> 00:45:25,950
been oh warning the country about the

986
00:45:32,450 --> 00:45:29,520
military-industrial complex essentially

987
00:45:34,930 --> 00:45:32,460
running thing and this would be the

988
00:45:38,240 --> 00:45:34,940
private corporations that they relied on

989
00:45:40,220 --> 00:45:38,250
for all these military contracts

990
00:45:42,890 --> 00:45:40,230
providing them with all their armory

991
00:45:47,300 --> 00:45:42,900
their weaponry and they essentially took

992
00:45:50,420 --> 00:45:47,310
over the right now control as far as the

993
00:45:52,640 --> 00:45:50,430
physical evidence of what we would is my

994
00:45:53,500 --> 00:45:52,650
classify as the reality of the UFO

995
00:45:56,270 --> 00:45:53,510
phenomena

996
00:45:59,510 --> 00:45:56,280
yes great summary and I'm very much on

997
00:46:02,840 --> 00:45:59,520
that page in terms of who had it and

998
00:46:04,610 --> 00:46:02,850
who's kept control of it and that kind

999
00:46:07,820 --> 00:46:04,620
of brings it full circle to make me

1000
00:46:10,820 --> 00:46:07,830
wonder is the reverse engineering maybe

1001
00:46:13,220 --> 00:46:10,830
complete enough now that they can use

1002
00:46:15,260 --> 00:46:13,230
this stuff for a higher agenda and

1003
00:46:18,140 --> 00:46:15,270
that's why it's finally in the

1004
00:46:22,600 --> 00:46:18,150
mainstream media in the CIA controlled

1005
00:46:25,010 --> 00:46:22,610
press because there's some other agenda

1006
00:46:27,410 --> 00:46:25,020
behind there that maybe we don't even

1007
00:46:31,130 --> 00:46:27,420
understand yet some kind of complex

1008
00:46:32,930 --> 00:46:31,140
military gamesmanship but I wonder if

1009
00:46:35,150 --> 00:46:32,940
that's any indication as to how far

1010
00:46:36,800 --> 00:46:35,160
they've gotten the fact that now of all

1011
00:46:37,950 --> 00:46:36,810
times it's actually out there in the

1012
00:46:41,250 --> 00:46:37,960
media

1013
00:46:44,309 --> 00:46:41,260
well you know great Don and I we don't

1014
00:46:46,230 --> 00:46:44,319
usually you know talk about these things

1015
00:46:48,870 --> 00:46:46,240
we're so focused on Roswell

1016
00:46:52,170 --> 00:46:48,880
it's labor-intensive over this last

1017
00:46:54,930 --> 00:46:52,180
quarter-century we don't speculate where

1018
00:46:57,870 --> 00:46:54,940
they're from why they're here those

1019
00:46:59,700 --> 00:46:57,880
sorts of things and it's difficult for

1020
00:47:02,599 --> 00:46:59,710
me because we've never talked about

1021
00:47:03,780 --> 00:47:02,609
these things but if you're talking about

1022
00:47:05,760 --> 00:47:03,790
back-engineering

1023
00:47:09,210 --> 00:47:05,770
we know that that happened we could

1024
00:47:11,790 --> 00:47:09,220
relate to that and you know something

1025
00:47:13,500 --> 00:47:11,800
like a CIA involvement of in that we

1026
00:47:15,059 --> 00:47:13,510
just haven't discussed those things but

1027
00:47:18,510 --> 00:47:15,069
we do know that they tried to

1028
00:47:20,630 --> 00:47:18,520
re-engineer this stuff and the only one

1029
00:47:25,140 --> 00:47:20,640
that I subscribe to because you know

1030
00:47:27,150 --> 00:47:25,150
transistors came from Roswell this and

1031
00:47:30,030 --> 00:47:27,160
that the other thing the only thing

1032
00:47:32,609 --> 00:47:30,040
that's come that I haven't done there's

1033
00:47:35,309 --> 00:47:32,619
enough substantiated documentation that

1034
00:47:37,410 --> 00:47:35,319
came out that I say okay well that I

1035
00:47:40,079 --> 00:47:37,420
believe was traceable back to Roswell

1036
00:47:42,440 --> 00:47:40,089
and that's that the memory medal they

1037
00:47:45,849 --> 00:47:42,450
wanted to find out

1038
00:47:49,940 --> 00:47:45,859
how they can re-engineer this sleight of

1039
00:47:53,059 --> 00:47:49,950
pliable metal that's bullet metal that

1040
00:47:55,849 --> 00:47:53,069
was indestructible and they sent it to

1041
00:47:58,910 --> 00:47:55,859
Patel Memorial Institute after the crash

1042
00:48:00,890 --> 00:47:58,920
and we have the documentation from the

1043
00:48:03,799 --> 00:48:00,900
project that they tried to you know

1044
00:48:06,680 --> 00:48:03,809
different combinations of elements to

1045
00:48:09,289 --> 00:48:06,690
try to reproduce this and they came up

1046
00:48:11,920 --> 00:48:09,299
with something they called nitinol it

1047
00:48:16,609 --> 00:48:11,930
was a an amalgam of nickel and titanium

1048
00:48:18,380 --> 00:48:16,619
and not only that but the Battelle

1049
00:48:21,650 --> 00:48:18,390
Memorial Institute didn't want to have

1050
00:48:23,630 --> 00:48:21,660
their logo associated with UFOs so they

1051
00:48:26,420 --> 00:48:23,640
laundered it through the naval ordnance

1052
00:48:30,319 --> 00:48:26,430
lab down in Washington or Maryland and

1053
00:48:32,690 --> 00:48:30,329
they the naval ordnance lab had a press

1054
00:48:37,370 --> 00:48:32,700
conference that they had discovered a

1055
00:48:40,460 --> 00:48:37,380
new amalgam called nitinol DNI you know

1056
00:48:43,160 --> 00:48:40,470
stands for nickel the TI stands for

1057
00:48:44,390 --> 00:48:43,170
titanium and the NOL stands for the

1058
00:48:47,990 --> 00:48:44,400
naval ordnance lab

1059
00:48:50,599 --> 00:48:48,000
Greg you can go online and buy it to

1060
00:48:53,150 --> 00:48:50,609
know by this sheet by the roll by the

1061
00:48:57,170 --> 00:48:53,160
coil you name it it's available but that

1062
00:48:59,720 --> 00:48:57,180
has its origins I believe because it's

1063
00:49:03,589 --> 00:48:59,730
well documented that project back with

1064
00:49:06,230 --> 00:49:03,599
the Roswell crash yes nitinol is a very

1065
00:49:07,970 --> 00:49:06,240
exciting element could definitely speak

1066
00:49:11,480 --> 00:49:07,980
to that reverse engineering and it is

1067
00:49:14,359 --> 00:49:11,490
interesting that you mentioned the naval

1068
00:49:17,030 --> 00:49:14,369
ordnance lab is part of its abbreviation

1069
00:49:18,950 --> 00:49:17,040
and we talked about the gamesmanship

1070
00:49:21,650 --> 00:49:18,960
between different groups it's like this

1071
00:49:24,230 --> 00:49:21,660
again is a Navy thing that's kind of

1072
00:49:26,680 --> 00:49:24,240
interesting right so one thing that you

1073
00:49:29,180 --> 00:49:26,690
Apple researchers have contemplated

1074
00:49:32,569 --> 00:49:29,190
speculated this discussed for many years

1075
00:49:35,539 --> 00:49:32,579
is that we have focused too much on the

1076
00:49:37,910 --> 00:49:35,549
Air Force a granite project sign karate

1077
00:49:40,280 --> 00:49:37,920
grudge product Bluebook the most famous

1078
00:49:42,710 --> 00:49:40,290
of the three they were the ones

1079
00:49:45,650 --> 00:49:42,720
releasing the disclosing you know their

1080
00:49:49,160 --> 00:49:45,660
efforts to come up with a resolution to

1081
00:49:51,950 --> 00:49:49,170
the mystery behind the UFOs but you know

1082
00:49:55,800 --> 00:49:51,960
the Air Force is very limited in their

1083
00:49:59,630 --> 00:49:55,810
global scope their global surveillance

1084
00:50:04,410 --> 00:49:59,640
aside from spy planes but the Navy is

1085
00:50:07,860 --> 00:50:04,420
able to truly you know draw intelligence

1086
00:50:10,740 --> 00:50:07,870
information from many more sources much

1087
00:50:13,020 --> 00:50:10,750
more territory I think that's why many

1088
00:50:15,870 --> 00:50:13,030
of us have felt that it was the Navy as

1089
00:50:18,450 --> 00:50:15,880
my naval intelligence has really had a

1090
00:50:22,980 --> 00:50:18,460
much greater influence I will Affairs

1091
00:50:24,300 --> 00:50:22,990
than the airport ever has yes I think

1092
00:50:26,760 --> 00:50:24,310
that you're right I mean we got to look

1093
00:50:30,240 --> 00:50:26,770
at all the branches and dig up all the

1094
00:50:32,940 --> 00:50:30,250
secrets and I am curious about the wider

1095
00:50:34,830 --> 00:50:32,950
scope of UFO research and even crashed

1096
00:50:36,600 --> 00:50:34,840
crafts you mentioned in the book that

1097
00:50:38,550 --> 00:50:36,610
one of your witnesses was told by

1098
00:50:41,880 --> 00:50:38,560
Wernher von Braun that there had been at

1099
00:50:44,700 --> 00:50:41,890
least three crashes recovered and as you

1100
00:50:47,310 --> 00:50:44,710
said your hyper-focused on Roswell

1101
00:50:49,140 --> 00:50:47,320
and I guess I'm curious because it seems

1102
00:50:50,670 --> 00:50:49,150
like we have a lot of other cases worth

1103
00:50:52,920 --> 00:50:50,680
looking into they just didn't have a

1104
00:50:55,710 --> 00:50:52,930
press release we know the Roswell story

1105
00:50:57,840 --> 00:50:55,720
we have about as much info into the

1106
00:51:01,140 --> 00:50:57,850
cases we can get more information just

1107
00:51:04,620 --> 00:51:01,150
sort of confirms what we know do you

1108
00:51:09,480 --> 00:51:04,630
think you might be missing the forest by

1109
00:51:11,730 --> 00:51:09,490
only studying one tree well for myself I

1110
00:51:15,990 --> 00:51:11,740
used to be interested in you know the

1111
00:51:19,770 --> 00:51:16,000
UFO panoply the broader picture but when

1112
00:51:23,280 --> 00:51:19,780
I read the 1980 book by Lauren Burrell

1113
00:51:24,840 --> 00:51:23,290
it's the Roswell incident for me I think

1114
00:51:27,480 --> 00:51:24,850
dogs worries too soon there are things

1115
00:51:30,870 --> 00:51:27,490
that I am you opposed speaking but for

1116
00:51:34,050 --> 00:51:30,880
me it affected me so much that all the

1117
00:51:37,230 --> 00:51:34,060
other UFO cases just disappeared for me

1118
00:51:39,750 --> 00:51:37,240
and I was only interested in this one

1119
00:51:41,940 --> 00:51:39,760
case because it wasn't lights in the sky

1120
00:51:44,730 --> 00:51:41,950
oh I saw a light up there did a right

1121
00:51:47,550 --> 00:51:44,740
angle oh my goodness what about look

1122
00:51:50,610 --> 00:51:47,560
would that be mr. Kerry you know you get

1123
00:51:54,330 --> 00:51:50,620
tired of that stuff but the Roswell case

1124
00:51:56,760 --> 00:51:54,340
it had a nuts-and-bolts craft that

1125
00:52:01,230 --> 00:51:56,770
crashed not a light in the sky but a

1126
00:52:04,320 --> 00:52:01,240
nuts-and-bolts craft it had wreckage it

1127
00:52:07,140 --> 00:52:04,330
had bodies on it little three and a half

1128
00:52:08,970 --> 00:52:07,150
to four foot tall bodies with big heads

1129
00:52:12,569 --> 00:52:08,980
and there there was a government

1130
00:52:16,109 --> 00:52:12,579
cover-up and threats it had everything

1131
00:52:20,640 --> 00:52:16,119
that a mystery thriller had and all the

1132
00:52:23,999 --> 00:52:20,650
other UFO phenomena just Greg I'm sorry

1133
00:52:25,890 --> 00:52:24,009
but it doesn't interest me and you'll

1134
00:52:28,470 --> 00:52:25,900
call this a labor of love it certainly

1135
00:52:32,220 --> 00:52:28,480
was a labor of extreme interest for me

1136
00:52:34,589 --> 00:52:32,230
to be on this one case since 1991 Don

1137
00:52:36,480 --> 00:52:34,599
was on for a little longer but this is

1138
00:52:38,430 --> 00:52:36,490
for me I don't know if you remember the

1139
00:52:41,130 --> 00:52:38,440
movie the verdict that starred Paul

1140
00:52:44,130 --> 00:52:41,140
Newman where he was just over the hill

1141
00:52:47,249 --> 00:52:44,140
lawyer and he got this paraplegic case

1142
00:52:49,289 --> 00:52:47,259
and his assistant there said he plated a

1143
00:52:51,900 --> 00:52:49,299
character's name was Frank Al but he's

1144
00:52:54,359 --> 00:52:51,910
at Frank you got to take their offer it

1145
00:52:58,650 --> 00:52:54,369
was an offer to settle the case he said

1146
00:53:01,589 --> 00:52:58,660
no no this is the case this is the only

1147
00:53:03,809 --> 00:53:01,599
case and that's the way I look at it and

1148
00:53:06,749 --> 00:53:03,819
when you ask me things about the CIA

1149
00:53:10,380 --> 00:53:06,759
it's things that I just don't I don't

1150
00:53:12,509 --> 00:53:10,390
see okay but yet it is true that the

1151
00:53:15,239 --> 00:53:12,519
right cat book we make reference to a

1152
00:53:18,930 --> 00:53:15,249
lot of the testimony regarding other

1153
00:53:22,229 --> 00:53:18,940
alleged crashes through the 50s into the

1154
00:53:25,499 --> 00:53:22,239
60s and it's certainly much emphasis on

1155
00:53:27,749 --> 00:53:25,509
the late Leonard Stringfield files which

1156
00:53:30,599 --> 00:53:27,759
in my case I'm personally very

1157
00:53:32,849 --> 00:53:30,609
disappointed because for having been

1158
00:53:36,029 --> 00:53:32,859
with the Center for UFO studies we were

1159
00:53:38,880 --> 00:53:36,039
promised to acquire his files at the

1160
00:53:40,620 --> 00:53:38,890
time of his passing because before the

1161
00:53:44,190 --> 00:53:40,630
first time we would have had all the

1162
00:53:48,029 --> 00:53:44,200
names and places that he had kept

1163
00:53:51,559 --> 00:53:48,039
confidential up at that time and I loved

1164
00:53:54,839 --> 00:53:51,569
the chase I loved as far as solidifying

1165
00:53:58,410 --> 00:53:54,849
Roswell by even incorporating other

1166
00:54:00,180 --> 00:53:58,420
cases suggesting that if one happened

1167
00:54:02,339 --> 00:54:00,190
than others you're all most likely

1168
00:54:04,670 --> 00:54:02,349
happen as well and reference to you have

1169
00:54:08,000 --> 00:54:04,680
all crashes and recovery

1170
00:54:11,120 --> 00:54:08,010
there I mean I definitely respect the

1171
00:54:12,950 --> 00:54:11,130
dedication you guys have had to endure

1172
00:54:17,390 --> 00:54:12,960
those things right here's the other

1173
00:54:20,059 --> 00:54:17,400
thing suppose you know in 1997 they had

1174
00:54:22,940 --> 00:54:20,069
that big brouhaha you know it's the 50th

1175
00:54:24,950 --> 00:54:22,950
anniversary of the Roswell is it suppose

1176
00:54:27,349 --> 00:54:24,960
all the investigators went home at that

1177
00:54:29,539 --> 00:54:27,359
point that's what we would have you know

1178
00:54:31,670 --> 00:54:29,549
we would have this big question oh my

1179
00:54:34,069 --> 00:54:31,680
goodness did it happen or did it happen

1180
00:54:38,000 --> 00:54:34,079
well Don and I have spent the rest of

1181
00:54:40,670 --> 00:54:38,010
you know since 1997 as a team to conduct

1182
00:54:43,690 --> 00:54:40,680
a proactive investigation of Roswell

1183
00:54:47,539 --> 00:54:43,700
like I said it's labor intensive we have

1184
00:54:50,180 --> 00:54:47,549
interviewed over 600 witnesses that we

1185
00:54:52,370 --> 00:54:50,190
have really nailed this case this is

1186
00:54:55,579 --> 00:54:52,380
what makes me mad we have nailed this

1187
00:54:58,309 --> 00:54:55,589
case with over 600 witnesses and each

1188
00:55:01,010 --> 00:54:58,319
one knows just a little bit of a story

1189
00:55:03,109 --> 00:55:01,020
and it's been our job to put the little

1190
00:55:05,180 --> 00:55:03,119
bits together to make a whole picture

1191
00:55:07,400 --> 00:55:05,190
here if we hadn't done that

1192
00:55:09,470 --> 00:55:07,410
you know Roswell would be just another

1193
00:55:11,690 --> 00:55:09,480
oh well that was a case you know that

1194
00:55:13,940 --> 00:55:11,700
they thought this and nothing has

1195
00:55:16,849 --> 00:55:13,950
happened since well I'm sorry we moved

1196
00:55:19,220 --> 00:55:16,859
the football across the goal-line in my

1197
00:55:21,309 --> 00:55:19,230
view and it took a lot of work to do

1198
00:55:24,950 --> 00:55:21,319
that you know we've had five

1199
00:55:28,130 --> 00:55:24,960
archeological digs at the crash site the

1200
00:55:31,039 --> 00:55:28,140
debris field yes today we have verified

1201
00:55:33,500 --> 00:55:31,049
that from multiple first and second hand

1202
00:55:35,809 --> 00:55:33,510
witnesses down to what was where and

1203
00:55:37,760 --> 00:55:35,819
where a Golic was and the outer

1204
00:55:41,150 --> 00:55:37,770
perimeter and how far the debris

1205
00:55:42,769 --> 00:55:41,160
extended and who found what where and no

1206
00:55:45,349 --> 00:55:42,779
one else can say that about any other

1207
00:55:47,120 --> 00:55:45,359
case they're trying to establish that

1208
00:55:48,980 --> 00:55:47,130
something happened at all in our case

1209
00:55:51,230 --> 00:55:48,990
it's a better destroyed fact that

1210
00:55:54,200 --> 00:55:51,240
something crashed left they hit a big

1211
00:55:54,769 --> 00:55:54,210
field sizeable proportion and here we

1212
00:55:57,799 --> 00:55:54,779
are

1213
00:55:59,630 --> 00:55:57,809
or even the Air Force concurs that were

1214
00:56:03,710 --> 00:55:59,640
at the right site because they obviously

1215
00:56:06,680 --> 00:56:03,720
need a project mobile crash location but

1216
00:56:09,230 --> 00:56:06,690
you know that's why I think so many of

1217
00:56:11,660 --> 00:56:09,240
our colleagues are even jealous and at

1218
00:56:14,089 --> 00:56:11,670
times they personally attack us because

1219
00:56:16,370 --> 00:56:14,099
by the time like to say that Roswell

1220
00:56:17,860 --> 00:56:16,380
takes all the air out of the rope when

1221
00:56:20,170 --> 00:56:17,870
it's discussed as fair

1222
00:56:23,410 --> 00:56:20,180
we had conferences and in private

1223
00:56:25,840 --> 00:56:23,420
discussion because it is a matter of

1224
00:56:28,510 --> 00:56:25,850
historic fact the others are just trying

1225
00:56:32,350 --> 00:56:28,520
to prove something happened at all

1226
00:56:33,820 --> 00:56:32,360
hmm well I respect your opinion for sure

1227
00:56:36,310 --> 00:56:33,830
and I wanted to ask a little more about

1228
00:56:38,620 --> 00:56:36,320
wright-patterson itself this major base

1229
00:56:40,630 --> 00:56:38,630
in Ohio you write if the Pentagon is

1230
00:56:42,370 --> 00:56:40,640
considered the brains of the Air Force

1231
00:56:45,670 --> 00:56:42,380
then wright-patterson is certainly its

1232
00:56:47,859 --> 00:56:45,680
heart well we all hear the wreckage and

1233
00:56:50,320 --> 00:56:47,869
alien bodies were transported to area 51

1234
00:56:52,150 --> 00:56:50,330
but pieces went all over to Fort Worth

1235
00:56:54,550 --> 00:56:52,160
to Lockheed Martin in the deep corporate

1236
00:56:56,050 --> 00:56:54,560
Nexus why is it so significant that a

1237
00:56:58,390 --> 00:56:56,060
lot of this stuff went to

1238
00:57:00,970 --> 00:56:58,400
wright-patterson so much so that this is

1239
00:57:04,570 --> 00:57:00,980
your second book on this element of the

1240
00:57:06,040 --> 00:57:04,580
story well you know the history of

1241
00:57:06,609 --> 00:57:06,050
wright-patterson will make your head

1242
00:57:09,160 --> 00:57:06,619
explode

1243
00:57:12,130 --> 00:57:09,170
it just it's going through so many

1244
00:57:14,080 --> 00:57:12,140
different name changes you know the

1245
00:57:17,140 --> 00:57:14,090
field and all no we won't get into that

1246
00:57:19,510 --> 00:57:17,150
it did my eyes glaze over just so in

1247
00:57:23,320 --> 00:57:19,520
that history but I'd like to pick it up

1248
00:57:25,840 --> 00:57:23,330
during World War two when it was Wright

1249
00:57:28,120 --> 00:57:25,850
Field in Patterson Field at Wright Field

1250
00:57:30,970 --> 00:57:28,130
you know this is where all of the

1251
00:57:34,020 --> 00:57:30,980
captured enemy aircraft went for

1252
00:57:37,480 --> 00:57:34,030
analysis there are back engineering and

1253
00:57:41,230 --> 00:57:37,490
they did that in hangar 23 which became

1254
00:57:44,740 --> 00:57:41,240
by popular nomenclature the hangar 18

1255
00:57:47,200 --> 00:57:44,750
all of the captured axis fighter planes

1256
00:57:50,260 --> 00:57:47,210
and what-have-you went there to be taken

1257
00:57:53,290 --> 00:57:50,270
apart to see what made them tick and try

1258
00:57:55,780 --> 00:57:53,300
to improve upon what they analyzed in

1259
00:57:59,410 --> 00:57:55,790
our own fighter craft that would defeat

1260
00:58:03,910 --> 00:57:59,420
them so the back engineering capability

1261
00:58:06,990 --> 00:58:03,920
was at Wright Field also they had a an

1262
00:58:10,390 --> 00:58:07,000
advanced aero medical facility for

1263
00:58:13,240 --> 00:58:10,400
biological material so beyond its

1264
00:58:15,340 --> 00:58:13,250
importance where intelligence the

1265
00:58:18,220 --> 00:58:15,350
intelligence focus was at

1266
00:58:21,910 --> 00:58:18,230
wright-patterson so there's only natural

1267
00:58:25,690 --> 00:58:21,920
that something of a foreign nature went

1268
00:58:29,650 --> 00:58:25,700
to wright-patterson because they already

1269
00:58:32,980 --> 00:58:29,660
were set up to handle analysis and in

1270
00:58:34,420 --> 00:58:32,990
fact engineering what-have-you so that's

1271
00:58:37,090 --> 00:58:34,430
why I went to wright-patterson

1272
00:58:39,520 --> 00:58:37,100
but like Don said earlier the town of

1273
00:58:42,250 --> 00:58:39,530
Dayton built up right around the base

1274
00:58:44,470 --> 00:58:42,260
and when you're

1275
00:58:46,720 --> 00:58:44,480
you know testing new aircraft which is

1276
00:58:48,400 --> 00:58:46,730
what they did there you know you can

1277
00:58:51,630 --> 00:58:48,410
have an accident and a lot of people

1278
00:58:54,340 --> 00:58:51,640
would be killed so in the early 1950s

1279
00:58:57,880 --> 00:58:54,350
when they're starting to think about the

1280
00:59:01,030 --> 00:58:57,890
spy planes this most notably the YouTube

1281
00:59:03,609 --> 00:59:01,040
and later on the sr-71 blackbird

1282
00:59:08,020 --> 00:59:03,619
they wanted their more remote facility

1283
00:59:10,950 --> 00:59:08,030
which became area 51 in northwest of

1284
00:59:14,320 --> 00:59:10,960
Nevada but it all started at

1285
00:59:16,900 --> 00:59:14,330
wright-patterson in Dayton Ohio where

1286
00:59:19,540 --> 00:59:16,910
all those Air Force functions took place

1287
00:59:23,109 --> 00:59:19,550
you know grace a lot of our colleagues

1288
00:59:25,840 --> 00:59:23,119
II that suggests that Roswell ended at

1289
00:59:28,510 --> 00:59:25,850
Roswell or that it ended with the

1290
00:59:31,870 --> 00:59:28,520
balloon press conference at Fort Worth

1291
00:59:36,010 --> 00:59:31,880
Texas with general Ramey but it is also

1292
00:59:39,820 --> 00:59:36,020
an historic fact that the wreckage from

1293
00:59:43,290 --> 00:59:39,830
Roswell went to wright-patterson even

1294
00:59:46,750 --> 00:59:43,300
the Pentagon announced that at the time

1295
00:59:50,859 --> 00:59:46,760
and in heaven's name why would you eat

1296
00:59:56,380 --> 00:59:50,869
the test rubber foil would string and

1297
00:59:59,290 --> 00:59:56,390
tape to see what made it fly and they

1298
01:00:01,210 --> 00:59:59,300
would suggest the vulgar balloon went to

1299
01:00:04,120 --> 01:00:01,220
right field for testing back at that

1300
01:00:05,950 --> 01:00:04,130
time and the irony that the very first

1301
01:00:08,859 --> 01:00:05,960
view of all project and then the truth

1302
01:00:11,530 --> 01:00:08,869
subsequent originated were headquartered

1303
01:00:13,540 --> 01:00:11,540
at wright-patterson projects I'd brunch

1304
01:00:15,210 --> 01:00:13,550
and Blue Book were all headquartered at

1305
01:00:18,599 --> 01:00:15,220
wright-patterson

1306
01:00:21,359 --> 01:00:18,609
they they had the FTD the farm

1307
01:00:23,690 --> 01:00:21,369
technology division is this specific one

1308
01:00:26,040 --> 01:00:23,700
and the foreign technology they were

1309
01:00:29,300 --> 01:00:26,050
originally concerned with was like you

1310
01:00:33,000 --> 01:00:29,310
know Messerschmitts that dawn flu and

1311
01:00:35,760 --> 01:00:33,010
you know Mitsubishi zand makes it

1312
01:00:38,069 --> 01:00:35,770
Russian aircraft so that's what the

1313
01:00:40,530 --> 01:00:38,079
original intent was but when they got

1314
01:00:42,540 --> 01:00:40,540
something like really foreign from won't

1315
01:00:44,460 --> 01:00:42,550
the planet that's that's where they sent

1316
01:00:47,550 --> 01:00:44,470
it because they were the only ones set

1317
01:00:49,559 --> 01:00:47,560
up to handle something like that hmm

1318
01:00:53,010 --> 01:00:49,569
fair enough yes it's definitely an

1319
01:00:55,650 --> 01:00:53,020
important chapter of our history and I

1320
01:00:58,349 --> 01:00:55,660
know we might never get the full story

1321
01:01:00,930 --> 01:00:58,359
but we have enough to feel confident

1322
01:01:03,210 --> 01:01:00,940
that the basic shape of Roswell has some

1323
01:01:05,130 --> 01:01:03,220
definite truth to it what drives you

1324
01:01:06,839 --> 01:01:05,140
guys to keep plugging away here as you

1325
01:01:08,640 --> 01:01:06,849
note a lot of the witnesses are dead now

1326
01:01:11,250 --> 01:01:08,650
the further up the timeline you get the

1327
01:01:13,020 --> 01:01:11,260
more efficient the quarantine seems to

1328
01:01:14,940 --> 01:01:13,030
be you've obviously confirmed the story

1329
01:01:16,740 --> 01:01:14,950
through all these investigative elements

1330
01:01:18,329 --> 01:01:16,750
what more are you looking for what would

1331
01:01:21,420 --> 01:01:18,339
really complete this journey for you

1332
01:01:25,020 --> 01:01:21,430
guys a simple word Greg a piece of

1333
01:01:29,730 --> 01:01:25,030
physical evidence would top it off and

1334
01:01:32,430 --> 01:01:29,740
as we have had many attorneys we've even

1335
01:01:34,290 --> 01:01:32,440
had two judges Horsley tell us that we

1336
01:01:37,859 --> 01:01:34,300
could take this into any court of law

1337
01:01:40,170 --> 01:01:37,869
and wind hands down there gauze keeping

1338
01:01:44,430 --> 01:01:40,180
in mind the government is presently up

1339
01:01:45,720 --> 01:01:44,440
to four official explanations and we're

1340
01:01:49,500 --> 01:01:45,730
the ones who have all the witnesses

1341
01:01:53,599 --> 01:01:49,510
regarding our definition as to what

1342
01:01:57,000 --> 01:01:53,609
happened back in 1947 so who would win I

1343
01:01:59,480 --> 01:01:57,010
mean we have to accept that all history

1344
01:02:02,609 --> 01:01:59,490
is based on personal observation

1345
01:02:05,819 --> 01:02:02,619
personal counts people are you know

1346
01:02:07,559 --> 01:02:05,829
placed on death row or nothing more than

1347
01:02:09,089 --> 01:02:07,569
being able to demonstrate that they have

1348
01:02:10,760 --> 01:02:09,099
the preponderance of eyewitness

1349
01:02:14,180 --> 01:02:10,770
testimony

1350
01:02:17,030 --> 01:02:14,190
and that is precisely where we stand

1351
01:02:20,510 --> 01:02:17,040
with Roswell the fact that we have all

1352
01:02:22,790 --> 01:02:20,520
the witnesses they have none and all

1353
01:02:27,110 --> 01:02:22,800
they can say is what you can't prove it

1354
01:02:28,640 --> 01:02:27,120
but unlike all the other UFO cases we

1355
01:02:30,560 --> 01:02:28,650
could point the finger right back and

1356
01:02:33,320 --> 01:02:30,570
demonstrate but you have the proof

1357
01:02:35,990 --> 01:02:33,330
you've been hiding it all these years

1358
01:02:37,790 --> 01:02:36,000
and that's why the likes of the late

1359
01:02:40,190 --> 01:02:37,800
Senator Barry Goldwater and the late

1360
01:02:42,620 --> 01:02:40,200
congressman Stephen ship and even former

1361
01:02:44,240 --> 01:02:42,630
presidents Clinton and Carter former

1362
01:02:46,160 --> 01:02:44,250
governor of New Mexico bill Richardson

1363
01:02:48,200 --> 01:02:46,170
you know can all be on this program

1364
01:02:49,400 --> 01:02:48,210
right now and all momentum the fact that

1365
01:02:51,710 --> 01:02:49,410
they couldn't get the truth about

1366
01:02:55,130 --> 01:02:51,720
Roswell either so then we're coming back

1367
01:02:57,500 --> 01:02:55,140
to the power brokers the ones who are

1368
01:02:59,960 --> 01:02:57,510
actually running things and then we've

1369
01:03:02,780 --> 01:02:59,970
come full-circle we're saying they also

1370
01:03:07,340 --> 01:03:02,790
control the truth about the UFO

1371
01:03:09,920 --> 01:03:07,350
phenomena and then visa be Roswell hmm

1372
01:03:11,630 --> 01:03:09,930
well cheers to that totally agree and

1373
01:03:13,190 --> 01:03:11,640
like so many things we talk about on

1374
01:03:15,980 --> 01:03:13,200
this show we have the numbers we have a

1375
01:03:17,720 --> 01:03:15,990
lot of data they love to dismiss but you

1376
01:03:19,400 --> 01:03:17,730
just can't break through the system for

1377
01:03:22,250 --> 01:03:19,410
that very reason you just mentioned so

1378
01:03:23,810 --> 01:03:22,260
very cool well I hope you guys find that

1379
01:03:25,520 --> 01:03:23,820
pot of gold at the end of the end of the

1380
01:03:27,920 --> 01:03:25,530
rainbow I've got a lot of respect for

1381
01:03:29,930 --> 01:03:27,930
the dedication you both have thanks for

1382
01:03:32,720 --> 01:03:29,940
sharing your knowledge before we really

1383
01:03:34,070 --> 01:03:32,730
go tell people about the book about the

1384
01:03:36,050 --> 01:03:34,080
other books anything else you got

1385
01:03:39,950 --> 01:03:36,060
working on or the website even that you

1386
01:03:42,470 --> 01:03:39,960
guys share well we have the current book

1387
01:03:44,870 --> 01:03:42,480
came out a few weeks ago we have another

1388
01:03:47,420 --> 01:03:44,880
book coming out this summer or early

1389
01:03:51,460 --> 01:03:47,430
fall called it's a coffee table type

1390
01:03:53,630 --> 01:03:51,470
book called Roswell the chronological

1391
01:03:55,930 --> 01:03:53,640
pictorial we're really excited about

1392
01:03:59,090 --> 01:03:55,940
that it tells the story of Roswell

1393
01:04:00,800 --> 01:03:59,100
start-to-finish in pictures that we've

1394
01:04:02,930 --> 01:04:00,810
accumulated over the quarter century

1395
01:04:06,470 --> 01:04:02,940
that we've been working on the case and

1396
01:04:09,770 --> 01:04:06,480
next year the book next year will be out

1397
01:04:13,400 --> 01:04:09,780
in June we believe called Roswell case

1398
01:04:15,260 --> 01:04:13,410
closed and it sort of talks about most

1399
01:04:18,440 --> 01:04:15,270
of the witnesses 99 percent are going

1400
01:04:22,220 --> 01:04:18,450
now so we put our final book together

1401
01:04:24,500 --> 01:04:22,230
and it will be out next Oh early summer

1402
01:04:26,150 --> 01:04:24,510
called Roswell case closed

1403
01:04:28,880 --> 01:04:26,160
so that's what we have when the

1404
01:04:31,490 --> 01:04:28,890
immediate horizon our two books that

1405
01:04:35,630 --> 01:04:31,500
will be coming out besides the one we

1406
01:04:37,580 --> 01:04:35,640
discussed today very cool well thanks

1407
01:04:40,400 --> 01:04:37,590
for sharing your knowledge with us you

1408
01:04:42,770 --> 01:04:40,410
guys definitely know a lot and keep

1409
01:04:47,090 --> 01:04:42,780
plugging away thanks for your time thank

1410
01:04:53,840 --> 01:04:50,130
sweet ladies of Lynch field dear

1411
01:04:56,190 --> 01:04:53,850
listeners July wrapping up nicely for us

1412
01:05:00,510 --> 01:04:56,200
had to pay homage to the Roswell

1413
01:05:02,370 --> 01:05:00,520
incident after 72 years well I didn't

1414
01:05:04,680 --> 01:05:02,380
have to you but new page sent the book

1415
01:05:05,520 --> 01:05:04,690
out to me and I kind of held on to it

1416
01:05:07,710 --> 01:05:05,530
for a while

1417
01:05:10,320 --> 01:05:07,720
I wasn't sure if we were gonna fit this

1418
01:05:12,570 --> 01:05:10,330
in or not but I thought if I really

1419
01:05:14,490 --> 01:05:12,580
brought my a-game and asked some deep

1420
01:05:15,930 --> 01:05:14,500
and challenging questions then we might

1421
01:05:17,280 --> 01:05:15,940
end up with something better than

1422
01:05:20,730 --> 01:05:17,290
another

1423
01:05:21,240 --> 01:05:20,740
Roswell 101 show and you can be the

1424
01:05:23,820 --> 01:05:21,250
judge of that

1425
01:05:27,000 --> 01:05:23,830
I know I handled this interview a bit

1426
01:05:28,620 --> 01:05:27,010
differently than usual but I thought it

1427
01:05:31,920 --> 01:05:28,630
was warranted given everything that's

1428
01:05:34,050 --> 01:05:31,930
going on I mean it's pretty common over

1429
01:05:36,390 --> 01:05:34,060
the course of the two-hour interviews

1430
01:05:40,260 --> 01:05:36,400
for me to save room for some questions

1431
01:05:42,810 --> 01:05:40,270
that extrapolate pretty far out from the

1432
01:05:46,770 --> 01:05:42,820
base that's laid by the actual work of

1433
01:05:49,830 --> 01:05:46,780
the guests or guests and I respect Tom

1434
01:05:52,590 --> 01:05:49,840
and Don a lot what they do is not easy

1435
01:05:54,599 --> 01:05:52,600
it's meticulous and detailed and of

1436
01:05:57,900 --> 01:05:54,609
course we're all on the same side here

1437
01:06:01,109 --> 01:05:57,910
but I struggle with how a person can be

1438
01:06:03,990 --> 01:06:01,119
fascinated with only the Roswell

1439
01:06:08,160 --> 01:06:04,000
incident and have no interest in the

1440
01:06:10,670 --> 01:06:08,170
wider scope of the UFO mystery even just

1441
01:06:14,210 --> 01:06:10,680
the military side of it I mean to me

1442
01:06:16,770 --> 01:06:14,220
context matters and anything that

1443
01:06:19,770 --> 01:06:16,780
surrounds the Roswell incident should

1444
01:06:21,840 --> 01:06:19,780
matter if Wernher von Braun said that

1445
01:06:25,349 --> 01:06:21,850
there were two other crashes which I

1446
01:06:26,730 --> 01:06:25,359
took to mean disconnected crashes but

1447
01:06:29,130 --> 01:06:26,740
even if he didn't say it there are

1448
01:06:32,640 --> 01:06:29,140
others I don't get how they could

1449
01:06:35,060 --> 01:06:32,650
register a zero on the excitement scale

1450
01:06:37,830 --> 01:06:35,070
but Roswell is hitting in the red zone

1451
01:06:39,300 --> 01:06:37,840
it doesn't make sense to me but it

1452
01:06:42,000 --> 01:06:39,310
doesn't have to make sense to me

1453
01:06:44,190 --> 01:06:42,010
everybody can be interested in whatever

1454
01:06:47,220 --> 01:06:44,200
they want to be interested in and maybe

1455
01:06:49,920 --> 01:06:47,230
we need this sort of hyper focus from at

1456
01:06:52,740 --> 01:06:49,930
least a few people their dedication is

1457
01:06:55,170 --> 01:06:52,750
obviously commendable and this book does

1458
01:06:58,710 --> 01:06:55,180
add several layers to the credibility

1459
01:07:00,300 --> 01:06:58,720
cake it's a thick cake at this point but

1460
01:07:02,670 --> 01:07:00,310
we're in an era where we are

1461
01:07:05,160 --> 01:07:02,680
using people who even know a guy who

1462
01:07:09,270 --> 01:07:05,170
knows a guy who saw something back in

1463
01:07:10,890 --> 01:07:09,280
1947 so I am glad Tom and Don are

1464
01:07:14,790 --> 01:07:10,900
keeping it on the record

1465
01:07:16,800 --> 01:07:14,800
adding to the history but if you have 50

1466
01:07:19,010 --> 01:07:16,810
witnesses and anecdotes that confirm

1467
01:07:22,650 --> 01:07:19,020
most of the major details of something

1468
01:07:25,080 --> 01:07:22,660
do you need 50 more is there a point

1469
01:07:27,420 --> 01:07:25,090
where we say okay this is more or less

1470
01:07:30,720 --> 01:07:27,430
confirmed now let's see what it means

1471
01:07:32,130 --> 01:07:30,730
let's push on this a bit further because

1472
01:07:34,350 --> 01:07:32,140
right now we're dealing with a

1473
01:07:36,720 --> 01:07:34,360
disclosure rollout on major networks

1474
01:07:38,730 --> 01:07:36,730
with a lot of the Talking Heads finally

1475
01:07:42,570 --> 01:07:38,740
handed their talking points on this

1476
01:07:45,210 --> 01:07:42,580
subject and it's concerning or it should

1477
01:07:48,330 --> 01:07:45,220
be Harry Reid's CIA intelligence

1478
01:07:51,570 --> 01:07:48,340
officers I suggest you watch this stuff

1479
01:07:53,280 --> 01:07:51,580
with a very skeptical eye and I guess

1480
01:07:55,170 --> 01:07:53,290
when this stuff started to be

1481
01:07:57,600 --> 01:07:55,180
coordinated across the New York Times

1482
01:08:01,860 --> 01:07:57,610
The Wall Street Journal CNN Fox and

1483
01:08:03,990 --> 01:08:01,870
MSNBC I started to think okay maybe it's

1484
01:08:06,480 --> 01:08:04,000
time to put the joking aside for a

1485
01:08:09,720 --> 01:08:06,490
minute this isn't just some silly

1486
01:08:12,240 --> 01:08:09,730
[\h__\h] from a pop punk band these are

1487
01:08:15,420 --> 01:08:12,250
dangerous people trying to control a

1488
01:08:17,700 --> 01:08:15,430
narrative with a very narrow frame that

1489
01:08:20,550 --> 01:08:17,710
ultimately could be used to let the war

1490
01:08:22,230 --> 01:08:20,560
machine do its thing or at least to

1491
01:08:24,960 --> 01:08:22,240
deceive the public into thinking that

1492
01:08:27,809 --> 01:08:24,970
the UFO situation is as simple as

1493
01:08:31,110 --> 01:08:27,819
mechanical crafts from hostile invaders

1494
01:08:34,530 --> 01:08:31,120
we know better than that we know it's a

1495
01:08:37,050 --> 01:08:34,540
much richer and deeper and long term

1496
01:08:40,590 --> 01:08:37,060
phenomenon relating to much more than

1497
01:08:43,770 --> 01:08:40,600
the military-industrial complex and we

1498
01:08:48,510 --> 01:08:43,780
need to be just a bit on guard I think

1499
01:08:51,360 --> 01:08:48,520
and people dealing with this sort of UFO

1500
01:08:53,700 --> 01:08:51,370
research have to be super careful right

1501
01:08:56,220 --> 01:08:53,710
now just with what they're putting out

1502
01:08:58,940 --> 01:08:56,230
there and signing off on and who they're

1503
01:09:02,070 --> 01:08:58,950
getting in bed with obviously

1504
01:09:04,349 --> 01:09:02,080
speculation is a major ingredient in the

1505
01:09:06,390 --> 01:09:04,359
THC recipe a lot of things we want to

1506
01:09:09,059 --> 01:09:06,400
know are off the table hidden behind the

1507
01:09:12,230 --> 01:09:09,069
curtain see you got a guess but when it

1508
01:09:14,340 --> 01:09:12,240
starts to relate to real operations I

1509
01:09:17,030 --> 01:09:14,350
tighten up a little

1510
01:09:20,010 --> 01:09:17,040
it's not just for fun anymore you know

1511
01:09:22,410 --> 01:09:20,020
maybe that's why today's guests don't

1512
01:09:25,289 --> 01:09:22,420
want to comment outside of their Roswell

1513
01:09:27,390 --> 01:09:25,299
focus I respect that but I just don't

1514
01:09:30,780 --> 01:09:27,400
think anything makes total sense in

1515
01:09:32,730 --> 01:09:30,790
isolation it's all right but there are

1516
01:09:34,230 --> 01:09:32,740
nuances in the book that they've

1517
01:09:37,349 --> 01:09:34,240
produced that I think are really

1518
01:09:39,090 --> 01:09:37,359
interesting despite being a person

1519
01:09:42,750 --> 01:09:39,100
already familiar with the Roswell case

1520
01:09:44,849 --> 01:09:42,760
like we all are so if you are interested

1521
01:09:47,340 --> 01:09:44,859
in that case overall and the Wright

1522
01:09:50,820 --> 01:09:47,350
Patterson connection it's a very

1523
01:09:53,010 --> 01:09:50,830
valuable book on an important saga in

1524
01:09:56,280 --> 01:09:53,020
our history I thank them for their

1525
01:09:58,440 --> 01:09:56,290
contribution it's easy to criticize but

1526
01:10:01,050 --> 01:09:58,450
I think if a lot of people compared

1527
01:10:04,310 --> 01:10:01,060
their own contribution before

1528
01:10:07,770 --> 01:10:04,320
criticizing they wouldn't get very far

1529
01:10:10,260 --> 01:10:07,780
but I do expect the listeners who got

1530
01:10:12,300 --> 01:10:10,270
through this interview to see a lot of

1531
01:10:13,470 --> 01:10:12,310
little subtleties that were worth the

1532
01:10:16,470 --> 01:10:13,480
price of admission

1533
01:10:18,810 --> 01:10:16,480
but again that's for you to decide and

1534
01:10:21,090 --> 01:10:18,820
of course Tom and Don both stuck around

1535
01:10:23,280 --> 01:10:21,100
for a second hour if you only heard the

1536
01:10:25,140 --> 01:10:23,290
first free hour you got to consider

1537
01:10:28,440 --> 01:10:25,150
becoming a plus member and getting the

1538
01:10:30,990 --> 01:10:28,450
full two our interviews in this one we

1539
01:10:33,150 --> 01:10:31,000
talked about Tom and Don's actual real

1540
01:10:36,090 --> 01:10:33,160
world visits to the crash site and some

1541
01:10:38,660 --> 01:10:36,100
of the readings they got space travel

1542
01:10:42,530 --> 01:10:38,670
and quantum physics Tom and Don's

1543
01:10:45,150 --> 01:10:42,540
thoughts on philip corso and bob lazar

1544
01:10:47,250 --> 01:10:45,160
elements of disinformation in the

1545
01:10:51,060 --> 01:10:47,260
roswell research and a lot of other

1546
01:10:54,210 --> 01:10:51,070
stuff so dive in the water is fine and

1547
01:10:55,980 --> 01:10:54,220
we have a very deep archive for you to

1548
01:10:59,940 --> 01:10:55,990
find all sorts of great stuff to get

1549
01:11:03,900 --> 01:10:59,950
into but we are coming in hot at the

1550
01:11:05,610 --> 01:11:03,910
zero hour on the 31st of the month but

1551
01:11:06,240 --> 01:11:05,620
that's gonna do it for me guys I've done

1552
01:11:08,940 --> 01:11:06,250
my part

1553
01:11:11,600 --> 01:11:08,950
your move disclosure roll out directors

1554
01:11:17,070 --> 01:11:11,610
metamaterial manipulators in area 51

1555
01:11:27,560 --> 01:11:22,230
woke up this morning with light in my

1556
01:11:31,010 --> 01:11:27,570
eyes and then realized it was done

1557
01:11:45,990 --> 01:11:38,000
it was a lie coming down from the sky I

1558
01:11:55,270 --> 01:11:50,450
must be those strangers that

1559
01:12:00,229 --> 01:11:55,280
every night whose saucer-shaped alight

1560
01:12:04,390 --> 01:12:00,239
but people are tied

1561
01:12:11,060 --> 01:12:04,400
the blue-green footprints left

1562
01:12:16,850 --> 01:12:11,070
glow-in-the-dark I hope you make it home

1563
01:12:24,509 --> 01:12:23,040
mr. spaceman won't you please take me

1564
01:12:32,310 --> 01:12:24,519
along

1565
01:12:37,979 --> 01:12:32,320
I won't do anything wrong hey mr.

1566
01:12:40,140 --> 01:12:37,989
spaceman won't you please take me along

1567
01:12:43,310 --> 01:12:40,150
the high

1568
01:12:48,810 --> 01:12:46,190
hold up this morning

1569
01:12:51,620 --> 01:12:48,820
[Music]

1570
01:13:01,550 --> 01:12:51,630
I weird I had it

1571
01:13:06,540 --> 01:13:03,950
written my name

1572
01:13:08,960 --> 01:13:06,550
[Music]

1573
01:13:14,610 --> 01:13:08,970
we'll see you

1574
01:13:18,550 --> 01:13:14,620
[Music]

1575
01:13:25,979 --> 01:13:21,190
won't you please

1576
01:13:28,440 --> 01:13:25,989
I won't do anything wrong

1577
01:13:33,009 --> 01:13:28,450
Hey

1578
01:13:45,530 --> 01:13:33,019
[Music]

1579
01:13:46,820 --> 01:13:45,540
face man

1580
01:13:52,100 --> 01:13:46,830
[Applause]

1581
01:14:04,970 --> 01:13:52,110
won't you please take me alone how long

1582
01:14:12,550 --> 01:14:04,980
do anything why don't you please take me

1583
01:14:12,560 --> 01:14:20,910
take me along the high